• March 29, 2024

Tough Decisions Ahead, As Eagles Try To Merge The Talents Of Kolb & Jackson

This season DeSean Jackson has been one of the most dangerous weapons in the game when Michael Vick has played quarterback and he’s been missing in action when Kevin Kolb has been under center.  Jackson’s strengths and weaknesses don’t blend with Kolb’s strengths and weaknesses.

I think it’s something that Andy Reid and Marty Mornhinweg discovered during training camp and the preseason.  One of Reid’s strongest assets is he doesn’t discuss weaknesses of his players publicly.

Some believe it’s a weakness but I beg to differ because Reid’s players fight for him on the field and I think that’s more important than giving good sound bites.

I do think Reid know he and GM Howie Roseman are going to have a tough have a tough decision to make going forward.  They will have to decide whether they’re going to build this team around Kolb or Vick.

If they build it around Kolb, then they’re going to have to figure out a way to merge the talents of  Jackson and the fourth year quarterback.  I’ve been telling you for a while now that Jackson isn’t a classic west coast offense wide receiver.  He can run all the routes, but he can’t stay healthy while taking the hits from linebackers and safeties in the middle of the field.

Jackson lives off of running deep posts and deep corner routes.  It takes a strong arm to get the ball to him especially on the deep corner routes.  You have to hold onto the ball to get Jackson’s deep routes involved in the game.

As you could see in the Niners game, Kolb does his best work in the middle of the field.  Jackson can run some shallow crossing routes against man-to-man and zone coverages, but his size eliminates him from running the slant.

I don’t think he’s caught a slant route yet this season.  Kolb throws the slant route very well.  It’s a staple of the west coast offense but it doesn’t make sense to throw them to Jackson and give opposing linebackers and safeties an easy shot at him.

When is the proper time to get the ball in the hands of Jackson.

Can you throw Jackson the wide receiver screens?  They’ve stopped throwing the wide receiver screen to Jackson.  He got knocked out of the preseason game versus the Kansas City Chiefs after catching a quick screen.

I talked to an NFL source recently, who said Kolb must learn how to get rid of the ball earlier on the deep routes.  It’s going require him learning how to get pre-snap reads of what the defense is going to do.  When you let it go early it means taking a big risk, but it’s the only way he get the ball to Jackson on those deep routes.

The source hasn’t been impressed with Kolb’s arm strength.  He thought the underthrow to Jeremy Maclin on the 42-yard gain said it all, when Kolb had to the opportunity to get his body and legs into the throw.

The  NFL expert, who has spent nearly thirty-years in and around the NFL doesn’t feel the marriage of Kolb and Jackson is going to work over the long run.  He believes the Eagles will wind up trading one of them out of here depending on how the rest of the season goes for Vick.

If number 7 stays healthy and continues to get the ball deep to Jackson and Maclin, the Eagles are likely to resign Vick and trade Kolb.  If Vick continues his high-wire act by taking hits while scrambling and continues to get hurt, the Eagles will go with Kolb.

Would that mean trading a Pro Bowl wide receiver, who is one of the most explosive weapons in the NFL?

Reid has already shown his hand regarding which quarterback he wants to go with.

GCOBB

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eaglez4ever
eaglez4ever
October 13, 2010 9:21 am

I think the decision has already been made. From what i heard Tom Hecert already called and asked about kolb so i say by mid season vick gets his extension. By the end of the season kolb will prob end up on the browns. Vick is still young espically fresh in football years cuase he was basically away from the game for three years. Considering this rib injury is prob the worst injury he has had in his carrer i think we could get 4 to 5 more SOLID years out of vick. We have the luxory of having two #1 recievers who feed of off the deep ball and i just dont c kolb as the guy. Vick just fits this team alot better atm with the weapons we have. Plus the team really does have a very confident swagger when vicks out there. I worry more about jackson then i do maclin if we keep kolb. I really do think jackson is a good kid and really wants to be a team guy BUT he is still a kid. A wide reciever at that. Ive noticed alot more when kold is in there that jackson will float away from the huddle if hes not getting the ball. He also seems to want to just flat out take himself out of the game like he did last week when i could c no injury happen to him but he is on the sideline riding the staionary bike. This is why i think the decison is already made even RIED cant be dumb enough to realize that it comes down to kolb going or kold staying pissing jackson off and jackson going . Seems simple doesnt it?

Marcus
Marcus
October 13, 2010 9:54 am

very good points G. With the disgruntled Vincent Jackson sitting this season out, how likely do you think the eagles and charges would be willing to make a deal, djax for vjax? He’s a much sturdier west coast option, that is if you are willing to keep Kolb around.

schiller
schiller
October 13, 2010 10:00 am

eaglez, in all due respect, one report of one call means a trade is going to happen to you? That’s pretty absurd in my book. I’m not saying I know what happens, but that’s a weak point to base your prediction on…

eaglez4ever
eaglez4ever
October 13, 2010 10:10 am

No offense takin at all schill. I may not have gotten my point across correctly. True the phone call could be a bs rumor. I think the browns would be on the top of the list to get kolb but i think there r other teams interested. The main reason i think a trade for kolb will go down before next year was simply this. If we keep kolb jackson WILL NOT get enough balls his stats will go to crap he WILL get pissed off and demand a trade. I think its that simple. I cant c giving up one of the most deadly wapeons in the nfl at the moment to keep a sub par QB. It just doesnt make any sesne to me . If i implyed i was some kind of rumor guru earlier i apoligize. I really think vick is just better suited to work with jackosn and maclin and we have all seen that up to this point. Again this is just my opion we could end up keeping kolb for all i know but i just really dont c that making ANY SENSE.

vinnietheevictor
vinnietheevictor
October 13, 2010 10:12 am

And again with the rush to judgements after 2 games this year.

As Matt Mosely of ESPN points out, last year Kolb and Jackson hooked up 10x for 250yrds and 2 tds in 2 games. Not altogether too shabby.

eaglez4ever
eaglez4ever
October 13, 2010 10:17 am

Vinnie he put that up against BS defenses bud so whats your point. I can c you want to stick up for kolb with all of these comments but no one is rushing to anything . Kolb has shown us everytime he has gotten in there (which i will partially agrre with you has not been much BUT ENOUGH TO MAKE SOME VALID JUDGMENT CALLS) that he a middle of the road QB. he is not GREAT …he is not TERRIBLE just a guy. Maybe he could find his niche being like feely a very very solid backup. I just dont c why you need to c a full season out of him to accept FACTS.

schiller
schiller
October 13, 2010 10:27 am

Eaglez – what about the FACTS that good QBs take time to develop, they usually need at least a full season of PLAYING TIME to really develop into quality starters – that’s a fact. Kolb has had less than half of that. Aren’t you ignoring that FACT?

Paul Mancini
Paul Mancini
October 13, 2010 10:33 am

Eagles would not pursue a player with the baggage of V Jackson to begin with.
Eagles will not be looking to trade D-Jax who is the most Dynamic player they have had in years.
They will develop plays to take advantage of his play-making abilities no matter who is QB
This is what Coaches and Coordinators get paid to do and I am sure they relish at the opportunites to create more plays,formations,…

schiller
schiller
October 13, 2010 10:33 am

Desean Jackosn has 2 TDs this year. I only remember 1, so help me out folks, but the one I do remember was thrown by Vick. It did indeed involve Jackson using his speed and elusiveness to get into the endzone – and IT WASN’T A DEEP THROW AT ALL. It was a short-intermediate route that DJAX turned into a TD. Now nobody, including myself, will argue against Vick having a very strong arm, and indeed stronger than Kolb…. but we’re blowing this way out of proportion. Vick to DJAX TDs so far = 2 (or less, I can’t remember). And at least half weren’t deep balls….

Again, this is the media, and in particularly Garry, stirring up much ado about not much at all.

Good receivers in the NFL get doubled and coached against, and I think that, along with the Oline troubles, has played into DJAX not having much involvement yet. I don’t buy the argument that Kolb can’t work with DJax. The evidence just isn’t there yet for me to buy that argument. Kolbs body of work is still too little to draw much statistical validity from (that’s a mathematical FACT) and he’s still improving.

phillywill
phillywill
October 13, 2010 11:04 am

by what people have seen so far
i pose this ? to eagle fans
u want kevin kolb as your future?
its pretty much yes or no answer

KTDawk
KTDawk
October 13, 2010 11:05 am

Djax second TD came against the Jags on that deep out.corner route. Vick put in on the money and on a rope and Djax took it down the sideline. Dont know if Kolb makes that throw but certainly can make the throw on the curl route that Djax scored on against the Lions. I think Vick is our guy going forward but keep in mind Joe Montana (who perfected the WCO, not comparing him to Kolb in the slightest) did not have a very strong arm. There have been plenty of successful QBs in the game who don’t have rocket arms but do get the ball out of their hands quickly and anticipate routes. Kolb does not show the ability to get the ball to a spot before the receivers break. he may have a quick release but if he isn’t anticipating (ie Drew Brees) then why does a quick release matter. hell i have a quick release but that doesn’t mean the ball is going to be where it needs to be.

eaglez4ever
eaglez4ever
October 13, 2010 11:06 am

Schill im really not trying to piss in your cheerios here pal just stating my opinion. I will never understand all of these die hard kolb fans. The guy has been given chances and not really done much. To say he desreves a full season to prove what he could do is just ridiculous. Why do you need to c more out a guy who has 6 tds and EIGHT INTERCEPTIONS in his entire career. Its like people r willing to let this seaon go to hell and to have us 3 and 13 cause kolb DESREVES a shot. F THAT NOISE. I like any true birds fan am about WINNING. Bottom line vick will win more games this season that kolb will. Not like it really needs to be debated cause next season i cant wait to hear the outrage when the guy gets traded even though we will prob make the playoffs this year with vick at the helm.

eaglez4ever
eaglez4ever
October 13, 2010 11:07 am

@ philly will ……NO

grifft
grifft
October 13, 2010 11:07 am

Don’t forget that we drafted Kafka this year, and he’s supposedly got a big arm, yet has familiarity with the WCO.

DJax has been doubled all year, in general, and he still managed to put up big numbers with Vick. I agree that it’s too early to tell how well this will work out, and I’m pretty sure that Kolb will develop a little more arm strength this offseason. With that said, I don’t think he’ll ever be a big arm guy.

I still am surprised at the WCO talk: we haven’t been a “true” WCO ever, nor should we really aspire to be if we want to leverage our talents.

vinnietheevictor
vinnietheevictor
October 13, 2010 11:18 am

Schiller…you’re preaching to the choir.

Dude has started and finished 3 games. KC, NO, SF. 2-1 in those with decent performances. He’s played in one half against GB. Dreadful. And one half against Wsh. Decent. That’s 4 full games. 4 games. There are no ‘facts” after that body of work. I guess Aikman is pretty happy he never began his career in Philly.

I’m throwing out the Balt game 2 years ago, ’cause Andy threw him to the wolves there. Leagues best D and Kolb threw the pass that was picked. He should never ever have been asked to throw there. He had just driven the entire field against Balt. I feel that was perhaps the worst playcall the Birds ever made…but I digress)

Eaglez what doesn’t make any sense is getting to the end of this year not knowing if Kolb can play while having 6 or 7 teams bid up Vick.

Phillywill. It isn’t a yes or no answer at all. You guys want decisions made on Kolb before we’ve even seen him for a 1/3 of a season. I want to see if Kolb is the future. I’ve seen a guy that has improved in each of his 3 appearances this year. Better each time he’s hit the field. I want to see him against the NYG pass rush. Want to see him when boos are raining down.

His arm strength is perhaps questionable, but frankly I think arm strength is lest important than ability to see field, read D etc. What did arm strength ever do for Jamarcus?

vinnietheevictor
vinnietheevictor
October 13, 2010 11:21 am

Eaglez…Bradford has played 5 games and has 6 TDs and 8 Ints and the Rams are 2-3 to start his career so I guess you’ll throw him out too then?

phillywill
phillywill
October 13, 2010 11:22 am

yea like eaglez we all come on here and every1 plays gm
ok ur on the clock eagels fans u have to make a move which 1 do u make im curious
i think its a simple yes or no
and i dont wanna hear he didnt play enough because andy is gonna have to make this decision regardless of how much kolb play
so yes or no
i got 1 no from eaglez
its simple do u want kolb as the future franchise qb for the eagles ?

phillywill
phillywill
October 13, 2010 11:23 am

bradford doesnt have vick behind him
hey vinnie do you want kolb as your eagles qb of the future?

Droc
Droc
October 13, 2010 11:27 am

Vinnie, you always throw out stats that mean squat! Lets talk about FOOTBALL. Everybody wants to throw out the 2 games last year and Kolb being throwing for 300 yards and DJax having over 100 yards. You throw out stats and act like I didn’t watch the game with my own eyes. I saw DJax catch a 7 yard slant that was actually thrown BEHIND HIM and take it 70 yards for a score. There were also many screen passes which netted chunks of yards. KC ran a soft zone the whole game in Kolb threw the ball in the middle of the field all day. That’s your 300 yards you and many ither want to chirp about. 300 yards in this league is not that big of a deal any more. I am sure Jake Delholme and Kyle Orton have their share of 300 yard games as well. Let’s talk without bias and just get down to football facts. If Kolb plays a subpar defense he can be servicable but when he has to PLAY QUARTERBACK and make ALL OF THE THROWS we are done. Stop it with the 2 games last year or at least look at them from a football prospective and not just pull out stats that make your point look better.

phillywill
phillywill
October 13, 2010 11:27 am

your not gonna see him as the qb this yr (maybe a few games )
so are you saying sign him to starting qb money next yr to back up vick again
is andy gonna say oh kolb hasnt played enough blah blah blah no he’s gonna make a decision
y is it so hard u wanna play GM any other time

vinnietheevictor
vinnietheevictor
October 13, 2010 11:30 am

I feel I know what the Eagles’ are going to get from Vick and I don’t think it is the bed of roses that many people think it is.

I want the Birds to start Kolb for the rest of the year and make the decision at the end. We know what Vick is (and he has more limitations than people here are willing to admit) Limitatations that were made clear over a 6 year career. We do not know what we have in Kolb. Therefore Kolb must start.

eaglez4ever
eaglez4ever
October 13, 2010 11:32 am

Man the way people r sticking up for kolb and thowing stats out there and 25 million excuses youd seriously think and ried just chose to sit joe montana after winning a super bowl. COME ON PEOPLE. I hope with the millions he is making to hold that clip board kolbs gets a REALLY BIG garage on his new house……..he will need it to store all of these VIOLINS being played in his honor. He could also build a moat around said garage and fill it with all of the tears that have been shed. Just saying…….

jphalines
jphalines
October 13, 2010 11:34 am

It seems pretty clear Reid loves his new Vick toy. The coaches see these guys everyday at practice in the off season and in camp. Kolb wasn’t impressive in preseason, but KC giving him trouble doesn’t look so bad now that they are giving everyone trouble. Don’t forget Vick was a turnover machine in the preseason games, neither qb was great. The Eagles were shopping Vick and getting no real offers, so it shows how even the coaches can’t predict how well a quarterback will do during the regular season. Kolb is probably amazing with a red practice jersey on, but no so relaxed with 300 pound guys looking to smash him. Vick’s toughness and willingness to do anything to win is evident and why I think he has the confidence from the fans and players. I hated him during the preseason, but this guys has grit and doesn’t seem to allow the pressures of a game to hinder his play. The fans can judge quarterbacks better than any other position in my opinion because the only real time to see how good they are is when the lights are on. If they are great classroom guys that great, but chaos doesn’t break out in the classroom like on Sundays so we see how they adjust on busted plays. This is why Reid loves Vick because he is the ultimate cover up when Reid’s complex plays don’t work as figured. Vick covers up many of Andy Reids warts and that makes him a very valuable to Reid and hard to let go.

vinnietheevictor
vinnietheevictor
October 13, 2010 11:36 am

Droc.

What top 5 Ds has Vick shred this year? Its cuts both was bud.

Droc
Droc
October 13, 2010 11:40 am

Stats are for Fantasy. Explain to me the last time you saw Kolb Step up in the pocket like a MAN and deliver a 25 yard stick route with a blitz on and the corners in press coverage. I’ll Wait…………..

Don’t worry I’ll tell you. NEVER. That is all I am looking for. Something that shows me he can make NFL Caliber throws. If Kolb showed me he can make these throws I would be fine because you can work on other aspects of the position. Either you can make the throws or you can’t

phillywill
phillywill
October 13, 2010 11:42 am

sounds like 1 for kolb to me
lol
i wont comment on his comments nor the ridiculous we know what vick is gonna do lol

Droc
Droc
October 13, 2010 11:44 am

Vinnie, here you go again with defensive stats and stat..stats..stats. Please lets talk technique and ability. MY POINT IS….. I saw and know that Vick and most other starting quarterbacks in the league can make ALL necessary throws to not be limited as an offense. I have not been Shown that Kolb can make all of the throws.

Lets please just talk about the ability to play the QB position in the NFL. To hell with the stats.

schiller
schiller
October 13, 2010 11:46 am

Eagles, I’m not saying Kolb over Vick. When healthy, I want Vick in. But I ALSO want Kolb to develop. Because he has not been traded, so when Vick isn’t healthy (that does happen right?) I want Kolb to be the best he can, and improve. It IS NOT EITHER/OR. WE HAVE BOTH QBS ON THE ROSTER. I do think that we should keep developing Kolb.

Eaglez, I have yet to see a ‘die hard Kolb fan’ like you mentioned, I for sure am not one. I am a person who knows statistics (though I hated it in school and find math horribly boring…) and that fact is that you need a big enough sample size (amount of full games) to evaluate a set of data. Kolbs isn’t big enough yet to say we know what he is. Fact is that Bill Walsh told Reid to draft the kid, and he has shown the coaching staff that he’s worth grooming. As an Eagles fan, I would love it if Kolb develops into a QB that can make this offense light up. It doesn’t happen over night and it doesn’t happen in four games. Now I know that patience is something that barely exists anymore in our culture, especially with technology and sports/media, so I’m not surprised that most eagles fans aren’t willing to be patient with Kolb. But that doesn’t mean that the fans who are and who are rational about who young QBs develop, are die hard Kolb fans.

Can you see the difference? (one Philly Will cant….)

eaglez4ever
eaglez4ever
October 13, 2010 11:46 am

GIVE TO THEM DROC lol

eaglez4ever
eaglez4ever
October 13, 2010 11:47 am

or should i say GIVE IT TO THEM DROC lol

schiller
schiller
October 13, 2010 11:51 am

Eagles, who at all is saying start Kolb over Vick? I’m not. Reid aint.

And despite the media, and here Garry, trying to start the conversation early, I don’t think the Eagles will make the decisions about extensions/signings… etc… until after the season when we see more of both QBs. So why get ahead of ourselves (cause it creates readers/listeners/viewers for the media)…..

Just watch and let the coaches make the decisions. I highly doubt that the Eagles do ANYTHING contract wise until after this season. The CBA deal is still unknown, and they’ve made it clear they don’t want to make risky deals, not knowing how they will turn out in realty.

So let’s watch and learn. Both QBs are on the team. When healthy, Vick gets the start. That’s all. That’s it.

schiller
schiller
October 13, 2010 11:53 am

DROC – making decisions off of emotions, impatience, NOW, ME, I see, I feel, I know, …… blah blah blah ignore math, statistics, science, history…. just act as I feel….

Would you run a business under those principals? If so, you’d be broke and unemployable. As a fan, I get that mentality, but if you think that’s how any NFL team is ran or wants to be ran, you’re a joke.

phillywill
phillywill
October 13, 2010 11:53 am

schill this should be ur dream
ur the eagles GM
who do u want as ur qb moving forward
cmon dont ignore me

drummerwinslow
drummerwinslow
October 13, 2010 11:54 am

When throwing more than 20 yards, Kolb has clearly shown a propensity for throwing into coverage. Even the Maclin reception should have been a pick.

The thing that bothers me most is that when Kolb has gotten pressured (blitzed), he played scared afterward, bailing on plays almost immediately. That’s why I’m perplexed as to why Washington and the Niners didn’t blitz.

Whatever success Kolb enjoyed last year was done prior to the teams learning his strengths and weaknesses. Now, that they have a better read on him, the Kolb/Jackson combo seems to have been shut down. It’s like when teams realized McNabb could run, they employed a spy on him and took that part of his game away.

Up to this point, Kolb seems middle of the road. When players come to training camp, they are given a small window of opportunity. What makes Kolb any different? Why does he deserve a full season to fail? If he showed flashes of brilliance, I would have stuck with from the beginning. But hasn’t shown anything close to brilliance.

Let’s be fair here. Most quarterbacks fail. MOST fail. And the rest become career back-ups and journeymen. Very few earn a long-term starting position. What has Kolb shown that inspires confidence that he’ll rise above the norm? He’s got more interceptions than TDs (after 4 years in the league). What quarterback has studied for 4 years, then come out below average, then gone onto greatness? When you factor in the number of times he’s thrown into coverage (after 4 years), I find it difficult to justify wasting an entire year of other players’; careers for Kolb’s sake.

In Peyton Manning’s first year he threw 28 picks, but he also threw 26 TDs. The mistakes were obvious, but it was also crystal clear that he could pass the ball. In that case, you exercise patience and allow your QB to develop. Let’s not forget that Peyton was a rookie, not a 4th-year understudy, who was developed and supposedly ready to step in.

In my opinion, four years have already been wasted, why waste another?

Droc
Droc
October 13, 2010 11:54 am

We all need to look at this thing strictly in a football sense. I am a High School football coach and I face situations all the time when I think higher of a player than I should have or one of my assistants have put in my mind that a player has more ability that he has. It happens all the time in all levels of the sport. I had to put the best player on the field because its fair to the team as they all know internally who should be playing ahead of others

drummerwinslow
drummerwinslow
October 13, 2010 11:57 am

I posted this early this morning, but wanted everyone to see it

ANDY REID’S TWIN – UNBELIEVABLE!!!!!

If you saw any of Green Bay’s 16-13 loss at Washington, you saw an offense that would make Graham Harrell and Colt Brennan jump in the air like Rocky and Apollo did in the ocean. The Packers spread the field and threw … and threw … and threw.

By game’s end, they had called 53 pass plays and only 14 runs. While Rodgers threw for almost 300 yards, calling a pass on 53 out of 67 plays has its downside:
a) The offense is slightly one-dimensional. The dudes out in front of Abercrombie have more layers than that.

b) No time is burned off the clock when protecting a lead (Green Bay led by at least a touchdown for a good portion of the second half).

c) The quarterback is susceptible to getting killed.

Let’s start with the last point. Rodgers is tough, but passing or attempting to pass on nearly every down has its risks. That risk was realized on Sunday when Rodgers suffered a concussion late in the game on a helmet-to-helmet hit.

Quarterbacks don’t suffer helmet-to-helmet blows, much less injuries, when they hand off the ball. Brett Favre might get tennis elbow from one of those ridiculous throwing fakes on running plays, but that’s about it.

The other thing injured from constantly passing was Green Bay’s chance of winning, which brings us to the first two points. Due to the one-dimensional attack, the Packers only scored 13 points against a defense they should’ve riddled for twice that many. Personnel-wise, Jim Haslett’s defensive unit doesn’t match up against McCarthy’s offense. Even without running back Ryan Grant, Green Bay had favorable matchups running the ball; Washington was constantly spread out trying to defend the pass, and Albert Haynesworth, the team’s best defensive lineman (in theory), wasn’t playing.
And still, the Packers had a comfortable 13-3 lead when they took over the ball with 6:42 left in the third quarter. Time to run some clock. So what did McCarthy order up on the next two series with a two-score advantage? Seven passes, three runs. One of those passes came on a third-and-1.
Let’s review: 10-point second-half lead, third-and-1, on the road … and they pass the ball! They had to stay on the ground in that situation. Why? Even if they don’t get the first down, more clock gets chewed in the process of running the ball.

It wasn’t just during the second half that McCarthy abandoned the run. The Packers ran Brandon Jackson out of a three-receiver set on their third offensive play of the game. Jackson, starting in place of the injured Grant, navigated his way through the front line maelstrom, made a brilliant cut, and wasn’t caught until he was 71 yards down the field. Jackson’s scamper led to Green Bay’s only touchdown.

So how many times did Jackson get to run the ball the rest of the half after getting 71 yards on his first carry? Two — two! In fact, the drive after his big run the Packers ran six plays: Pass, pass, pass, pass, pass, punt.

Fox analyst Troy Aikman said during the broadcast that McCarthy had mentioned in a pregame production meeting that “we want to maintain some type of balance,” and he didn’t want to go through another season where his quarterback got hit all the time (Green Bay allowed the most sacks in the NFL in 2009 with 51). That’s what makes McCarthy’s play-calling in this particular game all the more puzzling, because maintaining any type of balance is precisely what the Packers didn’t do.

RealTalk777
RealTalk777
October 13, 2010 11:57 am

Kolb has been in the NFL for 4 seasons…how much more time does one need to develop? I dont want to hear that BS about giving him field time…you have rookie QB’s straight out of college that start from the very beginning!
Jackson has 2 TD’s that is correct…The one that you dont remember is the one that Vick threw about 40 yards against Jacksonville that jackson caught in stride and took to the house. Also its not about just TD’s, two minute drill in the Lions game is prime example..Vick threw the ball about 50 yards to DJack in stride (50 seconds to go til halftime)..big play of the game getting Eagles down the field in a hurry…At the time the score was 14 to 17 (lions) That was a big play on a very deep throw, that setup the touchdown going into halftime! That type of throw Kolb can’t make….The deep ball Vick threw to Jackson off his back foot against the Jags went 50+ yards…Kolb cant make that throw…Also the TD’s and yards Jackson had with Kolb last year, was deceptive…one was a 10 yard pass, that Jackson took damn near 70 yards to the house…(that play right there makes up nearly 1/3 of the Kolb and Jackson production) Kolb put up one TD against the 49ers, the very first drive…after that he couldnt do anything but get 2 fields goals! If the defense didnt show up and have 5 takeaways the Eagles would of lost that game…Kolb did a good job managing the game, but other than that, thats all he did!

Paul Mancini
Paul Mancini
October 13, 2010 11:58 am

For the record,
Kolb is not going anywhere this season and will be back-up to Vick for the Season.,
Vick will be the #1 Starter and if he plays well & shows he can be durable, then the Eagles will most likely extend him a long-term deal ( Probably start negoitiating around the bye week over Halloween Weekend and maybe complete the deal by late November) A lot will depend on how Vick plays over
the next 4-5 games, If he plays at a high level then it’s a no-brainer, If Vick were to struggle, start making poor decisions & passes or is injured a lot, then maybe they don’t pursue a long-term deal
with Vick and let him walk after the season and then go with Kolb for 2011 as their #1 QB..
A very fluid situation, which should become more clear in the next 4-6 weeks as who will be
the permanent,future #1 QB for the Eagles moving forward.. Right now, VIck’s is #1 and his job to lose

Droc
Droc
October 13, 2010 11:59 am

Schiller, I am a Joke? I have more football knowledge in my pinky than you do in your entire body. Now I don’t really want to get into personal attacks here and if I ever met you would wouldn’t come out of your mouth like that to me so I understand the tough talk behind the cpu screen.

All I keep saying is stats are decieving and I am sure everyone knows that. Kolb and Kolb lovers I will just wait and hope to see him make NFL Throws. Period

drummerwinslow
drummerwinslow
October 13, 2010 12:05 pm

I still contend that the run is on its way back.

Over the last decade or so, the league has evolved into a passing league. Since that time, defenses have, slowly but surely, adjusted. Teams have been stocked defensive linemen, linebackers and safeties who are smaller and faster. As a result, QBs are being pressured (and injured) more often.

It’s time for the running back to re-emerge, especially the bulldozers, who will pave the way for the smaller, speedier backs.

schiller
schiller
October 13, 2010 12:07 pm

pw – I’m not ignoring you here. My answer, and FYI, an NFL coach or GM is FAR from my dream job but I digress….

playing your little fantasy, IF I were GM or head coach, I would literally take it 1 game at a time. You’re going to call me an idiot/kissup/corny coaches slave or whatever for saying that, but that is truly my mentality.

The Eagles are playing the Falcons next Sunday, and if Vick is 100% healthy and cleared to play medically (which I doubt), I’d start him – no questions asked. If not, Kolb. I wouldn’t make a decision about the Tennessee game until knowing about Vick’s health closer to that point. I’d proceed with that formula until the end of the season, at which point I’d meet with my staff, evaluate the season, look back at the stats and film, and put our heads together at that point about where to go from there.

If someone in my organization was pushing the idea of making a decision one way or another for the future, and trying to trade one of the Qbs to get value, I’d say – nope, hold your horses. It’s too important to have 2 good QBs in this league to give one of them away. If they are unhappy, well boo hoo. Keep them both till the end of the season and then let’s evaluate, and maybe keep both going forward. It’s too risky to put all of your eggs in one basket at QB with nothing but a rookie or weak backup behind them. QBs get injured in this league often (see Vick, A Rodgers this week….) etc… Also, if you go with Vick, there is the distinct possibility that the starting role and contract extension goes to his head and he does stupid off the field shit again.

We have draft picks to address the Oline going forward, already have weapons, and can keep building on the young D in the draft.

PW – that’s my answer

RealTalk777
RealTalk777
October 13, 2010 12:11 pm

So you think that what Kolb can give the Eagles is better than what Vick can give the Eagles? Not sure how one can come to that decision without some type of bias…When the world has seen Vick outplay Kolb in all of his starts this year (compare Vick starts to Kolbs starts last year and tell me who looked better) Fact of the matter is, Vick is a superstar caliber athlete, Kolb is not…I want my team in the hands of Vick! Hands down!

schiller
schiller
October 13, 2010 12:15 pm

Droc, sorry if I offended you. I didn’t call you a joke, I said that if you think NFL teams ignore stats and make decisions off of emotions and only what they see in regular season games, and operate under principles of impatience, THEN you are a joke.

That’s all.

I think it’s great that you’re a HS football coach, and I do respect your knowledge of the game. But do you admit that HS football is different than the NFL? NFL players don’t graduate after 4 years. So NOW has a different dynamic in the NFL. There’s a lot of differences between HS and the league. You admit THAT right?

schiller
schiller
October 13, 2010 12:17 pm

Drummer – I think that’s what you HOPE. But where have you seen it in the NFL? Where are the teams that are winning big because of the running game? Where is the evidence for the trend?

vinnietheevictor
vinnietheevictor
October 13, 2010 12:29 pm

Drummerwinslow, you’re kinda funny. You say that all you’ve seen is a Kolb that is “middle of the road”. Again, after 4 games you’re ready to say this with certainty, when you seem to ignore who really i s the ‘middle of the road’ guy in the equation. That’s Vick. He had 6 years in the league. What do you remember.? A guy that looks exciting (given), is highlight film material, but in the end, does not produce. I don’t want a highlight guy. I want a winning guy, and I have no idea yet if that can be Kolb. And if you are all absolutely convinced that Vick is that proven winner, then you haven’t been looking at his body of work.

Vick is a career .500 QB (save one 11-4 year) who has shown:
Innaccuracy (about 52%or so over his career)
An over reliance on his legs (which he still does BTW too much) He’s run 26 times on 122 attempts this year (that’s 21% of the time he’s off an running) Too much math for you?
He never looks to the other side of the firld when he rolls out.

“I want to see Kolb stand in the pocket and make a throw” “He’s scared.” These types of comments are beyond ridiculous. You know what’s going on inside Kolbs head??….clearly not, so you’re relying on what you see right?

Kolb is “bailing on plays” Throwing a checkdown is not bailing on a play. He’s inexperienced right now and is making the safe plays. Exactly what I would want to see him do.

Kolb has dropped back 89 times, been sacked 8 and run 5. He’s stayed behind the line of scrimage 95% of the time trying to throw. Sounds like a little fraidy cat to me.
Vick. 122 dropbacks. 11 sacks. 26 rushes. That means he’s stayed behind to find a WR 80% of the time.

phillywill
phillywill
October 13, 2010 12:35 pm

i find it funny that those who think vick just say vick and those who must like kolb or whatver the case say oh we have to wait guess that means he hasnt shown enough yet lol

RealTalk777
RealTalk777
October 13, 2010 12:45 pm

@ vinnietheevictor

Vicks career record is 38-28-1 which is 10 games over .500 which is more like .630 winning percentage!!! (games that took places over 4 years ago) This is a new Mike Vick, not the same Vick from the falcons…Come on dont act like you know everything and give untruthful stats!! You are complaining that Vick uses his legs too much? That is just ridicolous! Vick has escaped pressure and delivered strikes to wider receivers this year (35 yard strike to Jackson against the Lions on a 3rd and 14) You are making a lot of excuses for Kolb…are you his father, brother, best friend, boyfriend, relative??? Also as far as Kolb dropping back, you are not mentioning the times Kolb got rid of the ball due to pressure or the ball getting tipped because he didnt want to wait in the pocket….Diff is Vick doesn’t have to stay in the pocket and take an incompletion when he can pick up yards with his feet! Make all the excuses you want! Fact of the matter is this and this “VICK HAS A STRONGER ARM THAN KOLB, MORE EXPERIENCE, AND IS MUCH MORE MOBILE”
Be fair, dont be critical of one player! you throwing a lot of scewed stats out there!

Droc
Droc
October 13, 2010 12:51 pm

Shiller. point understood. I understand the dynamics from High School to College, and the NFL are different but the game in essence is the same. In High School we have to recognize, delvelop, and maximize a kids talents in 4 years and for college the same dynamic occurs on a shorter time scale.

The game and dealing with players talents within your team are the same on all levels. The NFL just has money involved which changes the game because if I choose wrong about a player in high school I can just sit him on the bench with only hard feelings from possibly the player or the parents. In the NFL if you choose wrong with a guy you probably gave him a big contract that you are now stuck with so you have to play the guy.

With this whole QB situation I am not an anti-Kolb guy nor a pro Vick guy. I just analyze the games and see a player not show the necessary ability on the field. Kolb was Supposed to be better than what we’ve had for 11 years and if Andy Reid would have let Kolb start over Vick knowing what we all know that would be total disrespect to the game and not to mention his locker room

schiller
schiller
October 13, 2010 1:02 pm

Droc, yeah I hear you. But Reid didn’t start Kolb over Vick, knowing what we know. And when Vick is healthy, Reid said he’s the guy.

But Droc, do you quit on a QB who you liked in practice for a long time, after 4 full starts? Isn’t that too early to say ‘we know what he is and will be’? The other factor you forgot to mention in comparing HS to NFL is the time period. Steve Young had a very successful NFL career after a long time of failure and slow development. How can you say you know all that Kolb will be at this point in his career – he has more than a four year window to develop, and he has shown improvements. G said it himself that the Washington D is a good one, and Kolb beat them.

Gotta Luv It
Gotta Luv It
October 13, 2010 1:09 pm

wha’ts not being mentioned is that this defense is not going to hold any of the teams we play to 17 pts and under…reid knows this and need #7 to score TD’s…#4 has 454 yds and 2 TD’s against the 30th & 23rd ranked pass defense teams…..Thats’ not going to cut it in the 2nd 3rd and 4th quarters of this season