• September 27, 2022

Do The Eagles Still Believe Graham Is Better Than Pierre-Paul?

It seems that after each week of the NFL season, the Eagles 2010 and 2011 drafts look worse. The top pick a year ago Brandon Graham was watching yesterday’s game on the sidelines.

The second round pick, Nate Allen, was in the game, but he got abused by Giants running back Ahmad Bradshaw. The running back grabbed Allen and threw him on his back. Yes with one-hand, he slammed on his back.

They cut the third round pick Daniel Te’o Nesheim and no other NFL teams were interested in him, so they signed him to the practice squad.

Their top three picks in 2011, Danny Watkins, Jaiquawn jarrett and Curtis Marsh were all inactive yesterday. The fourth round pick Casey Matthews was out there on the field getting abused.

Remember when we heard all that talk about how great the Eagles did in the draft in 2010 when they took defensive end Brandon Graham and the Giants took defensive end Jason Pierre-Paul. According to the Eagles, the talent of Graham and Pierre-Paul wasn’t even close. Graham was supposed to be far better than Pierre-Paul.

For some reason, the Eagles always believe the smaller guy is the better football player. Pierre-Paul is a big defensive end, standing 6’5″ weighing 280 pounds, while Graham is an undersized defensive end, stands about 6’2″ and weighs about 265.

After looking at the game once, then checking out it out again, I think Pierre-Paul was the best defensive player on the field for the Giants, yesterday. He had five solo tackles and two sacks against the Eagles best offensive lineman Jason Peters.

To put it simply, the dude is a beast. He’s in only his second season, but he’s already one of the best defensive ends I’ve seen thus far this year. I saw Graham standing over on the sideline checking things out as Pierre-Paul was having a great game.

I know Osi Umenyiora is supposed to be the starter at that position, but I don’t see him taking Pierre-Paul’s job any time soon. Pierre-Paul plays the run better than Umenyiora, but he’s not quite as fast as Osi. I don’t see any way they take him out of the lineup.

GCOBB

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Everz11
Everz11
September 26, 2011 12:39 pm

In a related story, the Eagles also still believe that N. Allen is superior to E. Thomas, J. McDougle is better than O. Umenyiori, LJ Smith rates higher than J. Witten, and as a rule linebackers must be under 230 pounds and are not allow to make plays behind the line of scrimmage.

jakedog
jakedog
September 26, 2011 12:53 pm

wow, mr. cobb, with all this truth telling you will soon be called a “hater”, keep it coming, maybe Lurie is reading

runtheball09
runtheball09
September 26, 2011 1:20 pm

good thing they moved up and didn’t take the safety like 99% of the fans thought was going to happen when we saw the trade alert on draft day. that solidified Andy Reid with me.

paulman
paulman
September 26, 2011 1:34 pm

I heard Bill Mahr on his HBO Show state a “New Rule” for the Philadelphia Eagles concerning Future 1st Round Draft Picks.. Starting in 2012 the Front-Office are not allowed to make any 1st Round Draft Selections until they Consult G-Man and his crew of 5 Draft Experts, then once a Consenus is made, then and only then can the Pick be announced..
G-Man’s 5 Draft Experts are,Songs,Birdo and NavyDave,Jakedog and DCar

runtheball09
runtheball09
September 26, 2011 1:37 pm

No wonder you’re such a fucking moron, you listen to demagogues like bill mahr.

jphalines
jphalines
September 26, 2011 2:07 pm

How good would JPP be lined up out wide to give him more room to work with. Washburn is the only coach making good things happen despite people saying the ends are too far out. Babin and Cole are still making tackles at or behind the line.
I will generally give the front office the benefit of the doubt regarding draft picks because they do the homework, but they keep trying to outsmart the league with the picks lately. There will always be misses with guys, but the Eagles have passed on highly rated players at need positions and pick surpises that they like.
Their player opinions seems to be fatally flawed.

skman7
skman7
September 26, 2011 2:39 pm

I understand that we dropped the ball with some of our draft picks. I still want to see Brandon Graham play this year. Right now Jason Pierre-Paul is clearly the better player. Andy Reid should be fired today. These same mistakes have been going on for ten years. Since you can’t get rid of the team its time for a coaching change. His decisions are horrible and his team wasn’t ready to play yesterday. I tired of people talking about the linebackers. We have a problem on both sides of the ball. Good coaches get the most out of what they have to work with while covering up weak links. For years now we don’t do that. Wake up Jeff Lurie stop counting your money and pay attention to what’s going on during he games!!!!!!

paulman
paulman
September 26, 2011 3:00 pm

Lighten up RTB,
I haven;t seen the show in about 3 years, but wanted to throw it out to share some of Country wide Sources… Go back to Russia will ya…

paulman
paulman
September 26, 2011 3:03 pm

Back on Topic,
What does it matter now if the Eagles selected BG over JPP,
JPP is not on the Eagles so there is no sense in thinking woulda, coulda, shoulda.. We are know that the Pick once they moved up should have been
Safety Eric Thomas.. If they stayed at #24, then it should have been OT B Bulaga or CB D McCourtey… Eagles need better Player Personnel Dept for the Draft and I have Volunteered my services for a nominal fee…

BigE
BigE
September 26, 2011 4:35 pm

Schiller is waiting in the wings to pounce on any negativity. He will say it’s only 3 games out of 16 and all teams have a 50-50 draft even though the Eagles are way below 50%. Perhaps he is the moron who is in denial or he is waiting for the eagles to trounce San Francisco.

drummerwinslow
September 26, 2011 4:37 pm

Would someone please buy our emperor a pair of draws, at least? His nakedness is quite disgusting.

BigE
BigE
September 26, 2011 4:39 pm

Andy is a great motivator bullshit. How do you motivate players who were never part of a Giants-Eagles rivalry. Lourie and banner are probably closet Patriot fans.

drummerwinslow
September 26, 2011 4:55 pm

Big E

Be nice, now.

sah
sah
September 26, 2011 6:40 pm

Brandon Tate, Laurence Maroney, Chad Jackson, Brandon Merriweather, Ron Brace, Darius Butler and Terrence Wheatley…..all former high round draft picks of the New England Patriots (the true gold standard) who are no longer with the team. Even a genius such as Bill Belichick can miss on a pick. The fact of the matter is that the draft is a crap shoot.

Saying a team made a mistake on a draft pick due to injury seems a bit unfair. I wonder if the same logic applies to Derrick Morgan (1st rd pick DE of the Titans) and Eric Berry, considering they both suffered torn ACL’s. And even if JPP was on the team now, the best case scenario would be him taking snaps from Juqua Parker. The Eagles have far bigger issues this year than to play “woulda-coulda-shoulda”

daggolden
daggolden
September 26, 2011 8:05 pm

The drafts have been a problem for years on this team. Hell if the Eagles would of just followed the best available board on draft day I guarantee you they would of had 3 x the success in the first round. The success this team for all them years comes down to two factor. JJ as defensive coordinator and /Westbrook being so dynamic in thier prime.

daggolden
daggolden
September 26, 2011 8:06 pm

and McNabb

slick1
slick1
September 27, 2011 12:53 am

OK! OK! But Reid is still smarter than anyone else, so there.

mimitaro
mimitaro
September 27, 2011 2:19 am

Not to mention Hakeem Nicks over Jeremy Maclin (not that Maclin is bad but still Nicks is a stud). And the Eagles not trading up to take Prince Amukamara when we were desperate need of a CB. Giants take him and we get Danny Watkins. Giants just constantly outdraft us.

paulman
paulman
September 27, 2011 4:28 am

2010raft has sent this Eagle Franchise back by about 2-3 Years in my opinion
Eagles orginally have 5 Selections of the 1st 120 Picks with 1 picks in the 1st Round (#24 Overall) 2 Selections in the 2nd Round (1 for McNabb Deal) and 2 Selections in the 3rd Round.. This was 5 good players the EAgles could have selected within the Top 120 Selections, but instead the EAgles move up 11 Spots in the 1st Round to Select Brandon Graham and gave away both their 3rd Round PIcks to do so and then had to trade one of the 2nd Rounders (to the Cowboys who picked ILB Sean Lee) to get back a 3rd Round pick which beceam Teo Neisham…

Are you kidding me, on paper you have 5 Selections of the Top 120 Playes in the 2010 Draft and you end up with Brandon Graham, Nate Allen and Teo Neisham.. This is horrible Drafting Strategy and analysis and now for the next couple of years and the Eagle will pay the price.. I don’t want to hear about how much value the Eagles got in the late rounds in selecting Coleman or Chaney.. There is a reasons that players are still on the board in the late rounds.. take away recent Free-Agnets signings off the Team and especially on Defense and alond the OL and where is the talent, the home grown young talent that has been developed into good NFL Players..I just see too many misses year after year with this Eagles Group..
You can add 2010 4th Rounder Trevor Lindley to the “miss list” also
Top 4 Selections for Eagles in 2010 Draft (Graham,Allen, Teo and Lindley) which is not very impressive, 2 off the team and 1 Struggling and lost Starters spot in NAte Allen, and 1 who is injutred but appears to be another situational/rotation player good for about 20 snaps a game which is not what you expect when trading 2 3rd Round selections to move up from #24 to #13 in 1st Round to take him .. I won’t go and say Graham is a bust for that’s not fair to him and it’s not his fault that the Eagles gave up so much to get him… but I believe as most NFL Draft Observors/Guru’s have stated about Graham.. IS that he would be a monster in a 3-4 Scheme as a stand up/edge Pass Rusher who would fit a scheme like the Steelers,Jets,Ravens,Redskins type of System… Obvioulsy the Eagles run a 4-3 and with Grahams short arms and lack of height, I don’t see him ever being a everydown DE in the NFL so to me he would have been a great pick towards the end of the 1st Round but not at #13 and not trading away a couple of valuable 3rd Round picks and also making the Eagles deal one of their 2nd Rounder to atttempt to accumulate some the traded away picks back…

mimitaro
mimitaro
September 27, 2011 4:42 am

Who is to blame for our crap drafts? Who makes the final say is it AR or Roseman or somebody else on draft day? Are our scouts just useless?

paulman
paulman
September 27, 2011 5:00 am

Probably a combination of both.. I think GM Roseman has the final say with Coach AR Blessing and I am not sure who the Scouts are or how much impact
But it starts at top with the Director of Football Operations and Head FootBall Coach AR..

nev856
nev856
September 27, 2011 5:23 am

another decision was getting rid of modrak , wasnt the reason : ried could do both jobs! paulman is modrak back in buffalo?

MaybeTheyCan
MaybeTheyCan
September 27, 2011 7:23 am

paulman – The Eagles didn’t waste two 3rd round picks on Graham. They can’t do much with ’em. The last stud third round pick was BWest.

Andy’s third round picks since 1999…
Curtis Marsh, Daniel Te’o-Nesheim, Bryan Smith, Stewart Bradley, Tony Hunt, Chris Gocong, Ryan Moats, Matt Ware, Billy McMullen, Brian Westbrook, Derrick Burgess, Doug Brzezinski

I’ll say that if Stewart didn’t have such as bad injury that might’ve turned out better.

jakedog
jakedog
September 27, 2011 8:29 am

paulman, someone should paste your analysis of the 2010 draftt on Banner’s or Roseman’s forehead so Lurie is forced to read it every day, and by this time next year you will make a similar, accurate assessment of the 2011 draft

SONGSRME2
SONGSRME2
September 27, 2011 8:38 am

Sah….what problems you think the Eagles have?

paulman
paulman
September 27, 2011 8:40 am

Actually Tom Modrack was relieved of duty after last off-season by the the BIlls Organization, there new GM Buddy Nix, is calling all the shots as far as the Drafat and Player Personnel Decisions for the BIlls now…

DCar
DCar
September 27, 2011 10:08 am

BigE, none of those f^#@ing coward, stepford, apologists, are going to to come on here, until the Birds win again! Then they can say see, told you so! F^#@ EM, I hope they stay in Reids @$$, where they belong!
@MTC, stop, you’re giving me nausea! Man that is some list of turds, there!

sah
sah
September 27, 2011 10:31 am

There are two main issues on defense. One is the lack of time involved in fitting new pieces into a new system, especially with a new defensive coordinator. the wide nine scheme works with the defensive linemen (Jenkins & Babin with 4 sacks & Cole with 3). The run defense has been feast or famine, with big plays skewing the overall yards per carry, which leads to the second issue…linebacker and safety play.

Linebackers have been an issue for a while, due to injuries & bad draft choices. But size has nothing to do with it; it’s more an issue of skill and technique. The average lb size in a 4-3 defense is around 5’11 & 240 lbs. Stephen Tulloch is actually smaller than Casey Matthews. Patrick Willis, Curtis Lofton, and Jamar Chaney are all similar in size..yet the results speak for themselves. And do we not remember the days of Chris Gocong or Stewart Bradley trailing behind a tight end on an out rout to the end zone?

Too many times we see the linebackers either taking poor angles or being indecisive. Most of our successful run stops are because of the play of the line. Every one complains about us drafting low when selecting linebackers, but it’s not like our higher picked linebackers fared any better. Besides the combo of Emmons-Trotter-Barber, linebacker has been the place of either retreads or failed backs. Just snake-bitten.

Safety play is an issue, but it isn’t as though it was ignored. Did you really think the Eagles were going to shell out the money for Mikell or Atogwe? And for all the calls for Darren Sharper, the first time he gets burned for a deep post route in coverage, people would be saying Levon Kirkland Part Deux i.e. the Eagles trying to plug a hole with a washed up vet. Besides replacing Matthews with Rolle & hoping for Allen to get back to full health, time is the best solution. The Eagles are notorious for slow starts

RealTalk777
RealTalk777
September 27, 2011 11:11 am

One problem on defense is we are not utlizing the 3 CB’s we have as a unit…There are too many packages in which only two of them are on the field….Anyone one of them can drop back into safety coverage and be an upgrade over Coleman or Page…DRC way too fast not to be in the game more often..

The musical chairs going on with the LB position is another key problem that could set the defense back in fact has set the defense back…Having the LB’s get drilled on their roles and assignments for the entire preseason, then the first two games of the season…Then move them around and drill different roles and assignements (particularly Matthews being a rookie, would struggle) In fact the LB’s is a young group, all the way around…All the LB’s have to adjust to the wide 9, not just the rookies..this is not an excuse this is soley on the coach to do a better job getting players to execute…this starts with Caldwell, yes…all of the talk about Castillo is warranted but the position coach has to step it up as well, he works much more closely with the group…

Castillo pisses me off, in his press conferences he is as generic as they come, he says he doesn’t want to show his hand….But what I’m seeing right now, is he has no hand and is strictly bluffing. He has the cards to be solid defense, but if you don’t know how to play them…then you fold good hands and play bad ones…

With all of that said…The Eagles will get better…Not because I heard Andy Reid say it…because I have faith in the football team…Eagles will turn it around! As a fan, if I dont believe that, there’s no reason for me to even follow the team for the rest of the season! For those of you that talk like you’ve given up, stop commenting and maybe you should stop following the team for this season, real talk!

Fly Eagles Fly! Lets Go! I haven’t given up! E – A – G – L – E – S….Eagles!

jott1972
jott1972
September 29, 2011 1:05 pm

Roseman is TERRIBLE at talent evaluation….Graham will NEVER be anything in the NFL… he was another wasted 1st round pick by Roseman and Reid.

FIRE the scouting department because they are doing a terrible job…the past 2 drafts have been abysmal!

jott1972
jott1972
September 29, 2011 1:07 pm

2010
Rnd Name College Note
1 Brandon Graham Michigan
2 Nate Allen South Florida
3 Daniel Te’o-Nesheim Washington
4 Trevard Lindley Kentucky
4 Keenan Clayton Oklahoma
4 Mike Kafka Northwestern
4 Clay Harbor Missouri State
5 Ricky Sapp Clemson
5 Riley Cooper Florida
6 Charles Scott LSU
7 Jamar Chaney Mississippi State
7 Jeff Owens Georgia
7 Kurt Coleman Ohio State

Chaney, Kafka and Cooper are the best players from this class and are mediocre…. Grade = F

riley1
riley1
September 29, 2011 2:20 pm

I believe that the problems is with the front office not knowing what they really want to be! Offensively, there is no staple to their O scheme. Essentially, they are a “sand lot” football team running West Coast schemes. To be honest, they are really dysfunctional. One minute they have big powerful lineman (Road graders) which are meant to be primarily run blockers, but they pass 95% of the time! Then, they go into the off season and do wholesale changes to the philosophy and re-tool it completely to be more athletic, smaller, and agile. However, now they decide to run more, but their linemen are 50 lbs lighter than most of the d lines in the league! Again, lack of organizational continuity.

Defensively, Csatillo touts that he is running JJ schemes still. Although, I only see vestiges of it! I don’t see what they are trying to accomplish, because just like on offense, they look like they are in a ch**nese fire drill.

They are getting 4-3 players but some are geared for different 4-3 schemes
Casey Matthews for example is more suited for a zone defense, but Juan Castillo is doing more man with the linebackers. So, this again is the lack of continuity year after year!

Juan Castillo is expecting more man responsibilities than Sean McDermott who seemed to be running more zone blitzes and cover three schemes. Over the past three years, they were drafting zone backers and safeties who were smaller and could scoot, but they have now changed philosophies defensively once again. Castillo is running more zone underneath with the corners and man with the LBs. The problem is that the corners they acquired are better suited for press man coverage! Castillo wants more man coverage out of his linebackers, but they draft Casey Matthews which is more of a zone linebacker!!! He doesn’t posses the speed to be a WIL in this system, which is why they were trying to force feed him into the Mike, and now why they moved him out of the WIL and onto the bench.

Another poor example of this constant changing is when AR goes out and gets Asante Samuels in free agency a few years back! It dramatically changed the integrity of the defense. At that point they no longer had the ability to create exotic blitz packages that they ran under JJ, b/c they had to play more zone behind Samuels. IMO this is what they did when they let Dawk go. Dawk was not a two deep safety, but a in the box safety. So, it was cheaper to draft a new FS that was more comfortable in zone and keep a cheaper Safety to play the box (=Q). Then, they saw how limited Q was when B Dawk was not covering up for him and they let him go. They obstensibly let go of 20 years of experience and working together in the secondary. They then let go of Stewart Bradley who would have solidified the SAM. Which leads me to the next point.

Their strategy in getting undersized linebackers really remind me more of the Tampa Two style such as Tampa Bay and Indy (fast and smaller linebackers). However, in that scheme you need slightly bigger interior linemen that are very athletic to get to the QB. Recently, they have been smallish upfront!! This has caused their undersized linebackers to be VERY exposed to the run! (Add to it the flaws in the wide 9 philosophy and it becomes a disaster).

To cap this, not suring up a defensive philosophy is causing them to be very susceptible to all kinds of the concerns. They are drafting so many types of players b/c they have not settled in on what they want to be!!!!~

I believe this also is the cause of their numerous hits and misses.They are trying to sure up holes for past mistakes. JPP for example would have been a better selection for a base 4-3 defense, however, because they want to be more like the Indy Colts defense, that they looked at Graham as the next Dwight Freeney!!! I see the attempts of what they are trying to do, but the bottom line is that they need to decide on what they want to be and go through the growing pains of getting there. Changing philosophies 3 times in 5 years has been very detrimental to the integrity of the defense. Players need to know what the coach is trying to accomplish. He needs to have the right players in place to make it work logistically. IMO that have too many disparate parts to have defensive integrity. Lastly, they are adding so many philopshies that it is affecting them knowing their responsibilities. AR get to the point or move on!

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
September 29, 2011 2:21 pm

Jott – I will play this little game with you – what is your standard, your grading criteria – what are the metrics other then your ignorance, lack of knowledge, lack of experince in any type of talent evaluation and too how many other teams have you applied this standard – – in typical GCOBB fashion I could probaly print any other teams draft picks and write F but see – you need a standard – what is the expectation for a 7th rounder? You are telling me we missed with Chaney and Coleman if they make the roster and contribute to ST – what is the standard, number of starts, picks – whatis it?

Harbor has looked pretty decent blocking and caught a ball – awhat is the expectation for a back up TE drafted in the 4rth rd? Graham and NAte Allen both had knee surgeries – if that is the standard, then every other team that drafted a player int he first or second round is also an F – so every team is an F – which makes your point moot and stupid – typical whiny GCOBB no-nothing sitting around bitching douche bags.

So let’s play – give me the criteria – what is the expectation for a first round draft pick from the 2010 draft – how is Tim Tebow doing out in Denver – or Kyle Wilson for the Jets – or Jared Odrick for Miami – bottom line is you haven’t looked at any of them have you – Brandon Graham has played in more games and has more tackles then a number of the other 1st rdrs –

And Nate Allen, other then a very bad game against the Titans last year, was highly regarded and doing a fine job for a rookie FS in the NFL.

Isn’t Lndley still on the roster – you mean a young CB is stuck not playing a lot on a team that has Samuel, 24, DRC and Hanson…. how dare he – he must be ass

you know what grade I give the 2010 draft – an I for incomplete, because every expert will tell you it is not fair to grade a draft for at least three years.

schiller
schiller
September 29, 2011 2:43 pm

Jott, are you INTENTIONALLY ignoring common wisdom? A rookie gets injured therefore he’ll never be anything? Is Eric Berry’s career over too? Do you think that making assumptions is not associated with often being wrong and making an ‘ass out of u and me’? Do you understand the concept that evaluating someone too early with too little of a sample size to evaluate is STUPID?

I just want to understand your thinking because either there’s something you have yet to explain or you’re exxpressing opinions that discount facts and science or you’re just being emotional and thoughtless.