• December 9, 2022

Andy Reid Has A Blindspot On The Defensive Side Of The Ball

I don’t care what anybody tells me, I respect Andy Reid’s knowledge on how to run an NFL offense.  He’s strongest in the passing game, but he knows how to put together a running game as well.  Yes, he might throw the ball too much at times, but he’s very adept at how to attack the defenses in the league.

Give him a week to look at your defense and he’ll put together a nice game plan to attack it.

Don’t get me wrong, he does screw up time management and gets away from the running game too ofter, but Reid and Marty Mornhinweg can game plan for an NFL defense with the best of them. He’s also very good at coaching quarterbacks.

Look at how much he has done with the quarterback talent that has come through this organization.  Just about all of Reid quarterbacks have played better for him than they have for any other coaches in their careers.

Let me make it plain, Reid’s problem is on the defensive side of the ball.  He’s got a blind spot when it comes to the defensive side of the ball. This was hidden for years with former Eagles coach Ray Rhodes’ defensive players leading the Eagles “D”.  Where would they have been on the defensive side of the ball without Brian Dawkins, Jeremiah Trotter, Hugh Douglas, Troy Vincent, Bobby Taylor and others?

I have little confidence in Reid’s ability to draft or coach defensive players.  He doesn’t know how to find those aggressive defensive players who will take your head off.  I don’t think he has any where near the same feel for defensive schemes and players as he does on the offensive side.

One of the best moves he ever made was hiring long-time defensive coordinator Jim Johnson, who unfortunately passed away a little over a year ago.  With Johnson aboard, Reid was able to focus on the offense and let the “Old man” do his thing on the defensive side of the ball.

Look at all the poor draft picks Reid’s teams have made down through the years.  The Eagles do value linebackers, but they don’t value them as much as other positions, so they’ve unwilling to draft them in the first round.  They’ve used numerous second round picks on linebackers, but they’ve missed on all of them.

Checkout how many times the Birds missed when using top picks on linebackers.  They took Barry Gardner in the second round in 1999,  Quintin Caver in the second round in 2001, Matt McCoy in the second round in 2005, Chris Gocong in the third round in 2006, Stewart Bradley in the third round in 2007,  Bryan Smith in the third round in 2009, Keenan Clayton in the fourth round in 2010, and Casey Matthews in the fourth round in 2011.

The other defensive problem which has hurt the Birds this year is their lack of experienced leadership on the defensive side of the ball.  Reid wasn’t honest with himself when decided on his defensive coordinator.  He might not want to admit it, but he doesn’t have a good feel for the defensive side of the ball.   Knowing this he should have hired somebody who like Jim Johnson, didn’t need help from Reid.  The BYU-grad made a huge mistake when he put two totally inexperienced people in charge of the defense.

First he took a career-long offensive line coach, Juan Castillo and named him defensive coordinator.   After that he went even further by naming rookie fourth round draft pick, Casey Matthews the starting middle linebacker.  Both Castillo and Matthews were guys running the defense without any experience or credibility.

When things went wrong early in the season, there was nobody to take over in the huddle or on the sideline and establish some calm and confidence. Normally when a big play broke the defense collapsed and never recovered.  All the defensive players knew that both Castillo and Matthews weren’t up to their jobs, so you can believe that they weren’t listening to them when something went wrong.

The truth of matter was that there was no experienced leadership on the defensive side of the ball during these situations because Castillo and Matthews were both learning on the job.  Only the guy calling the defense always talks in the huddle and early in the season it was Matthews.  Like Castillo, he hadn’t earned any credibility with the defensive players.

It was a case of the blind leading the blind.  The players know when somebody doesn’t know what they’re talking about.  Regardless of the line of work, you don’t start talking to auto mechanics about engines if you don’t know what you’re talking about.  You don’t talk to plumbers about plumbing unless you know what you’re talking about.  It’s not wise to talk to barbers about cutting hair if you don’t know what you’re talking about.

Experienced NFL players are quick to realize that a coach is out to lunch.  They’re much quicker to doubt the calls and decisions of a coach who doesn’t have experience or an impressive track record.  Coaches just like the players have to come in and prove themselves if they want people to follow them.  Reid obviously thought Castillo and Matthews were going to get a free pass.

Castillo still thinks like an offensive line coach when he talks each week.  He emphasizes fundamentals.  They’re important on the defensive side of the ball just like the offensive line, but Castillo’s number one job as a defensive coordinator is as a “strategist”.  He’s playing a complicated game of chess with the opposing offensive coordinator.  He must be focused on strategy.  It must be his priority while the defensive position coaches should be focusing on fundamentals.

Jim Johnson and other great defensive coordinator like Buddy Ryan, studied the tendencies of the opposing offense and the guys calling the plays, the offensive coordinator.  Too many times this year, Castillo has failed to make any adjustments to adjustments made by the opponents in the second half.

The defensive coordinator is the brain of the defense.  The linebackers and the safeties are the players who are supposed to be his extension on the field.  They must know more about the game plan than the other players.  The defensive coordinator needs to know his game plan and strengths, weakness and tendencies of the opposing offense like the back of his hand.  He must also know how to attack them.

Notice that the Eagles are inexperienced at all of the positions who are supposed to be the thinking part of the defense.  This tells me that the decision-makers who assembled this team are ignorant about how to play good NFL defensive football.    Good defenses must have players who anticipate what the opposing offense is going to do.  Many good defenses will let the linebackers and safeties change the defense to combat a certain formation in certain situations.

I would have loved to hear Matthews try to get order in the huddle after a big play.  I would have liked to have overheard some of the conversations on the flights home between Eagles experienced defensive players like Asante Samuel and Cullen Jenkins.  Samuel played for Bill Belichick and Jenkins for veteran defensive whiz Dom Capers, now they’re listening to the inexperienced Castillo, who is on the defensive side of the ball for the first time this year since coaching years ago for a high school team.

Reid should have taken his lack of a feel for the defensive side of the ball into account when he picked his defensive coordinator.  He should have gone with a safe choice.   Now it’s too late for this year.

GCOBB

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ozzman
ozzman
December 5, 2011 4:24 pm

Against every big time defense in big games the Great Andy’s offense has laid an egg.

paulman
paulman
December 5, 2011 4:53 pm

Spot on G-Man and is exactly what a lot of us have stated since Pre-Season and as the Season has progressed as it have become obvious to everyone that Castillo is in way over his head.. maybe they should have just moved him to LB Position Coach for a coupld of Seasons before throwing the D/Coordinator position at him… Now it’s all water under the bridge for there are 4 games left in the Season.. WHat do the Eagles do about this Defense in the Off-Season

I say Fire the Secondary Coach Johnny Lynne after the final game
Demote Castillo down to LB’s Coach

Hire one of the following to get this Defense Straightened out
#1) Chuck Cecil (former DC of Titans)
#2) Jack Del Rio (former HC of JAgs)
#3) Herman Edwards (former HC of Chiefs & Jets)
#4) Steve Spagnula (if he gets fired from SL Rams)
#5) Leslie Frazier ( if he gets fired from the Vikings)
#6) Eric Mangini (former HC of Browns & Jets)
#7) Mike SIngletary (fomer HC of 49ers)
#8) Mike Nolan (former HC of 49ers and DC for various teams)
#9) Butch Davis (former HC of BRown and UNC Tarheels)

#10) and Hire Paulman to handle the Draft …

drummerwinslow
December 5, 2011 5:08 pm

Thank you, Ozz.

Reid can exploit average defenses, but playoff-caliber defenses, not so much.

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
December 5, 2011 5:44 pm

et tu mr cobb, et tu – did you even for 1 second look at the names on the rosters before you made that absolutley FALSE statement about ‘ RHodes players’

I often wonder where the ignorant fans that know very little get these absolutely screwed up notions from and then BAM – I read it from someone like you –

pro-football-reference.com lists the rosters and starters for each season and as the eagles got better (5-9 to 11-5 to two 12-4 then finally 13-3 the rosters moved AWAY from Rhodes players, AWAY.

1998 3-13 the team gave up 344 points

D starters

LDE Greg Jefferson
LDT Hollis Thomas
LDT Brandon Whiting
RDT Bill E. Johnson
RDE Hugh Douglas
LLB James Darling
LLB Mike Caldwell
MLB James Willis
RLB William Thomas
LCB Troy Vincent
RCB Bobby Taylor
RCB Al Harris
SS Mike Zordich
FS Brian Dawkins

now in 99 the team actaully gave up MORe points 357

Now in 2004 the super bowl year the eagles went from the #19 Defense in 98 to the #2 ranked defense from 344 points to 260 points – and AGAIN here are the starters

LDE Jevon Kearse Reid pick up
LDT Corey Simon Reid draft
RDT Darwin Walker Reid pick up
RDE Derririck Burgess Reid Draft
LLB Mark Simoneau Reid
LLB Nate Wayne Reid
MLB Jeremiah Trotter* Left and came back – signed by Reid to vet minimum
MLB Mark Simoneau duplicate – Reid
RLB Dhani Jones Reid
LCB Lito Sheppard*+Redi draft
RCB Sheldon Brown Reid draft
SS Michael Lewis* Reid Draft
FS Brian Dawkins*+ oh my god – the lone holdover starter from Rhodes
true – one of the greatest free safeties ever –
we can ‘argue’ about Trotter – but he left in FA to the Skins and Reid brought him back

wow – oz – so all those playoff game wins a few years back were laid eggs? Oh I forgot – because we are having a bad year THIS year, its all bad – been bad, sucks, always has sucked… gotta think that som etime – maybe just once or twice – he beat a good D during those 10 playoff wins – in the entire history of the NFL – how many coaches have 10 playoff wins?

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
December 5, 2011 6:05 pm

OK – quick question – making the assumption that Reid DOES NOT get firedt before the end of the season – 1) when would the decision be made for Reid to NOT return, and 2) at what point will it be clear that Reid will return?

drummerwinslow
December 5, 2011 6:10 pm

No one every answered my question. This will certainly help me to see things more clearly.

How can you identify a poorly coached team?

nev856
nev856
December 5, 2011 6:13 pm

paulman i would like to see juan demoted out of the organization ! his working hard comments are as stale as :better job”
what r del rio s credential prior to jacksonville he must have been a sucessful d cord some where . and butch davis is an interesting forgotten name.
m morningwig has had his moments both ways that is !

SONGSRME2
SONGSRME2
December 5, 2011 6:16 pm

Reid can beat up on sub par defenses. If it’s a big game for all the marbles I’d take Gruden over Reid any day. With all the credit Andy gets….Gruden actually brought a warm weather team in Philadelphia with everything on the line outwitting a defensive4 genius in “The Late JJ” to take the Bucs to the Championship and hoist the trophy. I would take any of the Harbaugh’s over Reid right now.

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
December 5, 2011 6:34 pm

Songs – we are in agreement – I would have loved to have scarfed up Harboaugh (San Fran) – now a few things to drop in there – the HArboagh from San Fran finished his playing career in San Diego – and coached in Oakland before landing the job at San Deigo – then went to Stanford and San Fran – I give you this quick lesson becuase I (well my wife is friends) with Harbuaghs ex (her parents and my wife’s parents are both from Levittown Pa) Harbaigh San Fran will not leave CA until his kids are grown and gone – so even if the position were open – he was only leaving Stanford for 2 jobs – Oakland and San Fran –

andrew p
andrew p
December 5, 2011 6:35 pm

Drummerwinslow, this is how you identify a poorly coached team, keep in mind Reid also make all the player personal deciesions. read this and tell me how this is not Reids fault.

He sees Stacy Andrews leave Philly with $9 million after starting two games. He sees Kevin Curtis leave Philly with $15.3 million after having one great game and a bunch of mediocre ones. He sees $4 million pickup Vince Young throwing the football to the other team pass after pass after pass.

He sees Jerome McDougle drafted instead of Troy Polamalu, Brandon Graham instead of Earl Thomas, Trevor Laws instead of Calais Campbell.

He sees Chris Clemons, Chris Gocong, Antwan Barnes, Joe Mays and Brodrick Bunkley — non-factors here — join other teams and immediately excel.

He sees the Eagles stick with players who clearly can’t play, like Ernie Sims, Will James, L.J. Smith, Nick Cole and Reggie Brown. He sees guys regress, like Michael Vick, DeSean Jackson, Nate Allen and Stewart Bradley. He sees Day 1 draft picks making zero impact, like Daniel Te’o-Nesheim, Victor Abiamiri and Bryan Smith.

He sees his head coach punting when he should go for it and going for it when he should punt. He sees the ill-fated Ronnie Brown option play, the rookie punter underthrowing an open receiver by 20 yards, the fourth-down goal-line pass to Brent Celek that had no chance to work.

He sees it all.

He sees the Juan Castillo disaster. The 1-8 record at home over the past 365 days. The blowout losses. The lack of discipline. The NFL-record five blown fourth-quarter leads. The penalties. The missed tackles. The bickering coaches on the sideline. The “Fire Andy” chants and banners. The three consecutive years since a postseason win. Rory Segrest. A fan base furious every time it has to watch legendary Brian Dawkins deliver a huge play for the Broncos while his replacements bumble their way through missed tackle after missed tackle.

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
December 5, 2011 6:38 pm

Dumber windbag – to answer your question let me start off by saying this 2011 eagles team is poorly coached. There is very little in the grading scale (maybe the rookie kickers get Bs – the snapper gets a B+) on this team and coaching is poor –

how do you tell 1) turnovers, 2) penalties (especially delay of game) 3) unforced errors 4) big plays against 5) plays where u do not have the right number of players on the field and 6) plays where there is a WR wide open and ot a soul around – and lastly – but most importantly – record

so by every ‘graphic’ I would use, this year, the eagles are a poorly coached team

that answer the question?

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
December 5, 2011 6:44 pm

But NAdrew P – notice my last ‘factor’ HE WINS GAMES – do I yet again need to list the long and distiguished (almost as long as my johnson) set of accomplishments – THIS YEARS team is poorly coached – that does not mean the 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2006,2007,2009,2010 (i think i got those right) teams were poorly coached –

and Andrew – the draft thing – that’s the GM – the question was how do you tell if a team is poorly COACHED – but feel free to dog pile in

and where oh where oh where oh where did Brian Dawkins deliver (his one in three years) huge play – I saw NFL prime time while hitting the gym today and Dawkins was no where to be seen – he had a sack – but don’t let the facts get in the way of the embellishment – lets make the story really good – Dawk SO intimidated the 2-10 vikings and Ponder throwing to Percy HArvin that he only had 156 yards recving vice the 250 he would not have had had Dawk not been there

swear youguys just make this shit up

BigE
BigE
December 5, 2011 6:53 pm

History is history. Reid made many bad decisions this year along with the Putz Roseman and has had an average record since 2004. It’s time for him to pack it in with the Eagles. He and marty are great foir racking up meaningless yardage.

PETE60
PETE60
December 5, 2011 6:59 pm

owner fairy crap will cause destruction

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
December 5, 2011 7:10 pm

Big E – without the theatrics – this is the big questions going into the offseason is it not – you and I have no say – did Reid earn the chance based upon his previous (he did win the division last year) the chance to get ‘it’ back next year – or is he done – and Cowher – 2 years after his losing season, his 14th – won the SB – not arguing with anything you said – but I think that is the question and for me – when will that decision (sooner rather then later) be made –

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
December 5, 2011 7:11 pm

oh big e – I agree history is history – just don’t go trying to change it – your point of Reid post 2004 is a valid point

andrew p
andrew p
December 5, 2011 7:40 pm

navyeaglefan, what do those wins translate to? Lets throw everything else i posted out the door and go by HE WINS GAMES, lets see where those wins got us.All we have to do is look at what the Eagles have accomplished since reaching the big game in 2004.

2005: missed playoffs
2006: lost in divisional round
2007: missed playoffs
2008: lost NFC Championship
2009: lost in wild card round
2010: lost in wild card round
2011: 4-8, almost a lock to miss the playoffs

In the last seven seasons, the Eagles have had one legitimate contender. We can define what a contender is in various manners, but once the dust had settled, only the ’08 team had a real great shot at winning a Super Bowl.
I rest my case.

paulman
paulman
December 5, 2011 7:48 pm

Checking the Overall Record since the 2006 Season (Almost 5 Full Seasons)

The Eagles Record is as follows

Regular Season 52-39-1
Playoff Record 3-4

Total Record 55-43-1

I think the Fans deserve better

andrew p
andrew p
December 5, 2011 7:50 pm

I cant understand why people think this team is doomed if Reid goes, this team is imploading right before our eyes with Reid, look whats going on in Tennesee, Fisher was there for 12yrs and everybody thought it would take years for that team to recover and look where their at, 8-6, in the playoff hunt and every game i watched i saw a team playing with heart and giving everything they got, change is good people and in this case NEEDED, remember the Titans !

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
December 5, 2011 7:53 pm

well – if you followed on to what I wrote to Big E you would see I agrred with his assessment post 2004 – but don’t rest your case so fast now there big fella, back that bus up

you DISMISS making the playoffs by writing LOST but in 06, 08,09 and 10 the eagles did make the playoffs – that is not some easy feet – this is not some ‘gimme’ automatic – the eagles didn’t wake up and go ‘yawn, scratch’ we got this (what may VERY well be what happened this year) I also disagree with you about the 08 team – I think the 09 team the one that lost to Dallas twice (I didn’t check so sue me if wrong) one of the biggest problems there was Jamal Jackson blowing his knee out early and Cole was just not prepared to deal with Ratcliffe – shit happens right –
so by YOUR statement – 4 of the last 6 (go ahead use 7) years this team won enough to qualify for the playoffs – now go look at Cowher and how he did – go look at ANY coach but maybe 5 in NFL history – Reid is right up there with the best in terms of getting to the playoffs, playoff wins –

yes, I know, he needs to win the super bowl – right there with you on that

jakedog
jakedog
December 5, 2011 8:04 pm

blame the defense, it has played poorly, but your so-called franchise quarterback is a major reason for this season, he averages over two turnovers a game, he lacks pocket instincts, can’t and never will read a blitz, hurt too much, and is 20th ranked qb by passer rating, behind ole Kevin Kolb, biggest mistake Reid made was caving to pressure and naming Vick his starter, maybe the decision wasn’t his, made for him, but to me this season was salvageable if the quarterback was not putrid

paulman
paulman
December 5, 2011 8:15 pm

Paulman Rankings of NFC Conference Teams

#1) Packers (12-0) — Playing for History, Their HC isn’t pussing out like the Colts Coach Caldwell did a few years ago.. (The Colts have never been the same either)
#2) 49ers (10-2) — Playing very well and smart, do not beat themselves, keep it very simple but execute and wear opponents down in 2nd half..
#3) Saints (9-3) — Defense is playing better as Playoffs get closer, starting to create Turnovers and when they do, they are tought to beat.. Superdome is the loudest and most difficult place for an opponent to play
#4) Atlanta (7-5) Better than the rest remainging
#5) Cowboys (7-5) Up and down, HC Garrett not a NFL HC
#6) Lions (7-5) – No running Game, DT Duh has hurt this club this year
#7) Bears (7-5) – No Cutler, No Forte, No Chance
#8) Giants (6-6) – Eli and WR Cruzz having great Seasons, Defense is not
#9) Cardinals (5-7) – Winner of 2 in a Row, Kolb Back from Injury
#10) Seahawks (5-7) – HC Carroll always has them playing well late in the Season (losing LT R Okung for rest of Seasons will hurt)
#12) Panthers (4-8) – Winners of 2 Road games on the Road, playing hard and building a winning attitdue around Cam Newton and HC Rivera
#13) Eagles (4-8) – The Most Disappointng Team of All-Time in the History of the NFL.. A complete Meltdown, Choke and Overrated Team by most
#14) Redksins (4-8) – DFefnese still playing hard but Offense is brutal and will now lose 2 of thei rbetter players on Offense (LT T Williams and TE F Davis) to 4 Game Suspensions for the remainder of the Season) due to failed Drug tests amnd bring repeat offendors
#15) Vikings (2-10) QB C Pnders has given them some hope for the Future
#16) SL rams (2-10) A Killer opening schedule & injuries doomed this team and HC Spags from the get go.. Took a big staep backwards from last Season

SONGSRME2
SONGSRME2
December 5, 2011 8:23 pm

Here’s the sad part about this defense thing, and I see it coming.

“Paste it” guys…..

Juan Castillo will take the fall and all the blame which will give the stiffs currently holding jobs on our defense another year in another failed season.

Watch.

Nate Allen, Matthews, Patterson, should be outta here…along with the rest of our failed drafts the last 2 years.

But these damn bums will get a pass.

the Eagles need to do everything they can to get Dawk back here to put some experience and fight up the middle of this defense in the secondary. They better do everything they can to draft Burfict for the linebacker and bring in Lance Briggs with Chaney rounding out the bunch.

Ship Asante outta here and get a Corner with tackling ability opposite Asmo and that means shiping DRC the hell outta here too. He sucks.

Give Graham one more shot starting opposite Cole with Babin coming in certain downs as a specialist.

scrap the damn wide 9 and bring in the linebacker coach from the Packers to coach the defense with his Philosophy. No Reid interference.

Don’t let Juan Castillo no where near the defense…Have him coach the gunners on special teams …. with the new kick off rule limiting runbacks this job should be a great place for him to teach fundamentals.

Bring back Childress as assistant head coach for the offense, so we’ll have a coach that will challenge Reid’s pass happy philosophy while getting the best out of an up and coming star in McCoy.

Yall might hate me for this but we should let Young go and sign McNabb to back up Vick so we’ll have a QB who can step in with no drop off and run a system he excelled in.

Cut Riley and get a top tough, STRONG, tall, Reciever with our extra 2nd round pick that can put fear in defenses and challenge for the number one recieving job.

cut Steve Smith.

Get a top tier tight end with speed in the 3rd round and let’s kick some ass next year and finally hold up that trophy!

But I digress.

If Andy’s here …he’ll find a way to create another blind spot.

“TIME’S YOUR’S”

paulman
paulman
December 5, 2011 8:32 pm

Just to put how bad the Eagles are in perspective
They are tied for last place (with Redskins) in the worst Division in the NFC Confernce, yes thats right, the NFC Est is the worst Division in the NFC Conference when combing the total records of Teams in the Division

Rankinsg of the NFC Divisions by Victories

#1) NFC North (28-20) – The Best Division in the NFC
#2) NFC South (24-24) – 2 Good teams, 2 Young teams
#3) NFC West (22-26) – Take the 49ers out and
#4) NFC East (21-27) – Pathetic Performance by the NFC East

Take the Eagles 3-1 Record versus NFC East Foes and they are 1-7 versus the rest of the NFL.. This is horrible and embarrasing.. a 1-3 Record versus the NFC West this year..

paulman
paulman
December 5, 2011 8:41 pm

Songs.. LB V Burfict has fallen by many Scouts accounts and has had a poor Senior Season and some questions have arised about his work ethic and attitiude.. Eagls should have a Top #6-#8 Pick and and may have a shot at
QB M Barkley, WR J Blackmon from Oklahoma State, or DE Q Couples from UNC, QB L Jones, or Safety Mark Barron from Alabama, CB Dre Fitzpatrick from Alabama or DT D Still from Penn State or ILB M Kuechley from Boston College would be my guess for the best players in that range

drummerwinslow
December 5, 2011 9:16 pm

Second question:

Can a poorly coached team still win (not necessarily the SB, but say 10 games a year, or so)?

Everz11
Everz11
December 5, 2011 10:08 pm

Truth is you can manipulate stats and numbers to support any side of an argument. Those who like Reid will twist them one way and those that don’t another. Reid is a great planner. He is a very apt offensive mind. He is not a great coach. Reid did have a nice stretch of winning seasons, with JJ as DC. Since 2005, they have been about a .500 squad. Since JJ died, even worse. 2004 was the only season where I honestly felt like we could win it all. But even in the best of times, when push came to shove the philosphy of this team under Reid always lost when it counted. Even when the team wins you come away feeling like #1 in cross-country race or a spelling bee. There is no physical element to Reid’s teams, they always try to “out smart” the opponent, rather then just beat them. I hate the Ravens and the Steelers, but I envy the way they play the game. Win or lose, their opponent has taken a beating. Ironically, they both have SB rings as well. I guess my point is, Reid has been a good coach, but after 13 years, we see season after season the shortcomings that a Reid team has. I’m ready for a change like much of the rest of the fanbase and have been that way for several years now. Its just easier to overlook when your sneaking into the playoffs and hanging onto false hope.

MaybeTheyCan
MaybeTheyCan
December 5, 2011 10:14 pm

IMO – Reid is a good coach, not great coach and not good enough to let him continue to coach MY TEAM more than 13 years.

I say My team just like I believe it’s also YOUR TEAM because we’re not paid to be affiliated with OUR TEAM and we will be fans long after Reid, the coaches, the players and the owner.

Times Ours!

MaybeTheyCan
MaybeTheyCan
December 5, 2011 10:17 pm

I sould qualify to say “not good enough to let him continue to coach MY TEAM more than 13 years without having won at least one SB”

paulman
paulman
December 5, 2011 10:22 pm

Nice Posts Everz11 & MTC,
Drummer I think a average Coach can get on a roll with a Talented Roster and win 10 Games or so and make the Playoffs, but will not win the big one..
Here are some questionalbe HC in recent Seasons that I think have contributed to their Teams not WInning the Super Bowl depsite the Talent Levels on their respective Teams

#1) Coach Andy Reid – Philadelphia Eagles
#2) Coach Norv Turner – San Diego Chargers
#3) Coach Brad Childress – Minnesota Vikings
#4) Coach Wade Phillips – Dallas Cowboys
#5) Coach Jim Caldwell – Indianapolis Colts

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
December 5, 2011 10:50 pm

Jesus Paul man – OK – lets add Bud Grant, George Allen – Don Coryll, Dennis Green (15-1 with the Vikes and Cunnigham – kicker misses 1 kick all season – last one in the NFCC game) Dan Reeves – Sam Wyche, Chuck Knox. Jon Fox, Jim Mora (do those USFL championships count – loved me some Stars) Sid Gillman, MArv Levy and on and on and on

I absoluitley do NOT think a poor coach can take a team from 3-13 to 4 straight NFCC games – WHILE ALMOST THE ENTIRE ROSTER TURNS OVER, 13-3 and the Super bowl – have a down year, then come back and qualify again for the playoffs – you can NOT be ‘lucky’ 9 of 12 years – this is just improbably BULLSHIT you guys are making up to try and justify wanting to get rid of Reid – this is like a polticial assassination, I have heard and read every line of crap possible – by your guys assessments the ONLY decent coach this team has ever had is Greasy Neil

BY ALL of your definitions – at this point in his career Bill Cowher should have been fired 2 straight losing seasons, 3 years not in the playoffs – super bowl loss – FIRED – instead they let him continue – guess what couple years later ANOTHER losing season – guess what 2 years after that SB win

Paulman – please remind those less knowledgable int he crowd – Norv Turner got his job after Marty Schottenhiemer went 14-2 and ‘couldn’t get them to the SB’

do you guys just completely ignore history

Everz saying Reid had a ‘nice stretch’ is like saying Tom Brady’s wife is decent looking – really – ya think?

STOP LOOKING BACK – stop trying to rewrite history – any of you guys invest – past performance is no garuntee of future results – that is pro or con – the decision (thankfully noit made by any emotion school girls from this site) is can Reid turn the team around and bring them back to super bowl contention – I pretty much know the response from this crowd –

and as for JJ – let me remind my kindred spirit that the Eagles D had many chances to salt away some victories while JJ was here – the Cardinals NFCC game – that Saints playoff game in Atlanta when we couldn’t stop the run,

I guess my next thing to say is this – you want to judge Andy Reid – judge him, then use those EXACT same standards to judge every other current and former coach – see how well Buddy Ryan or Dick Vermeil stand up to your mighty ‘lucky’ standards – could Juan Castillo have been a good DC with Reggie White, Mike Pitts, Jerome Brown and Clyde Simmons, seth joyner et al? Hmmmmmmmmmm – every one busts Reid – how about when Buddy Ryan compared his rookie MLB to Mike Singletary hmm. or wait – he cut Cris CArter? Talk about a guy who folded in big games – a career .500 head coach –

and remember one thing – Buddy Ryan won a division championship in 1988 – anyone guess who the next eagle coach to win a divison championship – that’s right AR in 2001

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
December 5, 2011 11:57 pm

Drummer – let me give you an example – a coach walks in to a bad team – he goes 5-11 then 4-12. At the start of his third season his starting QB goes down with an injury and an unknown undrafted rookie catches everyone by surprise goes 13-3 and wins the super bowl – then retires –

he then goes to another team – goes 6-10 then 8-8 then 13-3 then 7-9 – then 10-6 but not making playoffs – so lets see is this a talented coach – or a lucky coach 21-24 with one team 44-36 with another with 2 playoff seasons out of 8 – is this good coaching or a team that got lucky and won one super bowl because they had a unique offense and got lucky at QB

SONGSRME2
SONGSRME2
December 6, 2011 12:02 am

theres no such thing as luck

DCar
DCar
December 6, 2011 2:11 am

G,
it isn’t that he has a blind spot for that side of the ball, it is his ignorance & stupidity of his talent evaluation that is his problem. When is the last time we drafted a defensive difference maker, Corey Simon, the Brown, Sheppard, Lewis draft. That’s a long time ago! He ignores the LB position, & he couldn’t pick a good defensive linemen if he fell on him. Also his fascination with the over-sized Smurfs (oxy-moron), throughout the defensive side of the ball, has killed this team, for at least 4 years now. Insyead of drafting players at positions they play, he is ignorant, arrogant & thinks he can always fit square pegs into his round holes. He & his entire staff, including Rosebuds, need to go!

DCar
DCar
December 6, 2011 2:16 am

Also he doesn’t have JJ to bail his @$$ out of the dumper anymore. JJ instituted great game plans & always used the players he had wisely, & had Reids respect to get him his type of players. Even though they were small then, along the defensive line, JJ used them correctly.

SONGSRME2
SONGSRME2
December 6, 2011 7:09 am

Dcar….Lito, Sheldon and Lewis were all drafted by Modrak if I can recall. The problem started when Modrak left and Reid took over personel.

paulman
paulman
December 6, 2011 8:55 am

I agree 100% with Songs,
Ever since Modrack was terminated and AR Hire his lappy Heckert as the GM, the Teams overall Drafts were not very good and again on the Defensive side of the ball they were downright horrible, now fast forward another 5 years and Banners Puppet-Yes man H Roseman is calling the Shots with the Draft and then even have more misses in the Draft.. The Problem with this Oraganization has been the lack of a real Football Talent Evaluator at the GM Position..A Person who knows the Game of Football.. Until this Changes, I really don’t see the Eagles ever competing at the Highest Level Consistently year in and year out with this Current Regime. Yes the Eagles have Talent and will score points and win 9-10 Games a Seasons and get bounced right out of the Playoffs with their lack of Identity as a Defensive Unit.. What is this Eagle Defense, can anyone tell me.. where is the heart,strenth, the gang tackling, giving up your bofy to make plays, taking a players head off when coming across the middle… It’s been a few Seasons since we have seen any of this and I blame Coach AR/GM Roseman and even Veteran players like T Cole, M Patterson,A Samule as well who all play “Soft” and now have the youngsters following their lead.. Isn’t “Mr Softee” based in Philadelphia.. Good Grief..

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
December 6, 2011 10:01 am

well now lets hold on YET AGAIN – um, lets see – unless my crack pipe was laced this morning – Lito Shepard, Mike Lewis and Sheldon Brown were drafted in 2002?Tommy Modrak was here 1998-2001 and was with the Bills for the 2002 draft – what could it be – why yes it is SONGS IS WRONG AGAIN –

again – look at history and try to rewrite it – the same ‘great guy’ for drafting brought you Simon, McNabb, Trotter etc – also brought you Freddie Mitchell and Todd Pinkston (but wait – we didn’t ‘value’ wide rcvrs……) and barry gardner –

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
December 6, 2011 10:04 am

SOngs – then stop trying to credit the success the eagles have enjoyed during the Reid ‘regime’ to anything other then Reid beig the head coach – Reid went out and GOT JJ – they (the FO) then made him I think the highest paid coordinator in the league to keep him from being hired away –

and D – JJ blitzed – he sent more guys then there were O Lineman and had great success – and then as the league evolved (short passing game – quick releases etc.) the blitzes did not work as well – it is absolutley OK to think JJ was a great DC responsible for a lot of the eagles success, the TEAM, the ORGANIZATION can all enjoy there part in the success –

paulman
paulman
December 6, 2011 10:17 am

All water under the bridge now, Navy, The Eagles suck this years and next years Schedule is brutal …Their Coaching Schemes are stale and have become way too predictable and their Drafts the last few years haave been very poor on the Defensive side of the ball if you ask me.. Coach AR is the man in charge and this team has gotten and Coach AR’s syestem has become a litte more flawed and predictable each Season while the same old issues never have been resolved.. Scoring Efficiency in the Red Zone for boh the Offense & Defense, Clock & Time Out Mananagement, Penalties, Mental Mistakes, fundamental Tackling has gotten worse and worse…

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
December 6, 2011 10:37 am

Right there is the BULLSHIT so prevelant on this site – the past is the past – let the past be – but then some freakin moron that clearly never played, coached or had any other involvement and self admits to ‘sitting in a meeting’ with his sons coach constantly tries to re-write that history to sell some bullshit version of the past to try and make the argument for the future – it pisses me off –

OK – you say to me Hitler was a communist – I will turn to you and say – no Hitler was a NAzi Socialist – he hated communists – I am not defending Hitler, I am stating facts –

The decision on what to do with Reid going forward should be based on what is best for the Eagles organization, there is no need to go back and corrupt the past – aka – political assassination – If Redi is TOTALLY responsible now – then he was TOTALLY responsible then – if hiring Juan Castillo = very bad then hiring JJ = very good – that simple

yes, the eagles SUCK this year – they SUCK – that does not mean they sucked before this year – the question is – can Reid fix this or is it time to move on

vinnietheevictor
vinnietheevictor
December 6, 2011 11:26 am

Hyperbole central!
The blanket statements are all ridiculous (well, except MV sucks – but that’s mine so its clearly acceptable)

My favourite from this thread?

“He sees Chris Clemons, Chris Gocong, Antwan Barnes, Joe Mays and Brodrick Bunkley — non-factors here — join other teams and immediately excel.”

Immediately exel? You’ve got a low valuation for the word exel Andrew.

Broderick Bunkley (Denv) 25 tackles. No sacks, fumbles, hurries. Excelling!
Chris Clemons 27 tackles and 1.5 sacks for Cleveland. Excelling!
Antwan Barnes 23 tackles 6 sacks. Excelling!
Joe Mays 53 tackles. 0 anything else. Excelling!
Chris Clemons – fine, you hit one…. 19 sacks over 2 years with Seattle, but was released by 3 teams prior to Seabirds….not just Eagles giving up on that guy.

Ok….so what are these guys? They’re just guys. They’re not “excelling” since they left the Eagles (perhaps Clemons, but again, 3 teams bailed on that guy). Ther was noting wrong with any of their releases/trades.

As far as the birds missing on draft picks…well duh. I can’t remember what the stat is on failed players but its incredibly high, but take a look at the first round picks for yourself. Everyone thinks a draft pick (esp a high one) is supposed to somehow guarantee superstardom, and if that doesn’t happen, then the drafter is an idiot. This is flawed logic as the draft is nothing better than a glorified slot machine that pays out on about 30% of its spins.

Check out the first rounds:
From 2008 11 solid guys, 3 ok, 15 guys I’ve never heard of and 2 busts in the top 5
From 2009: I see 12 solid guys, 3 ok players and 15 “who are they” guys

The draft is a complete and utter crapshoot. That the birds missed on some first round picks makes them the exact same as every other team in the league who thinks they know what they’re doing, but don’t.
Bad drafts. By almost every definition, every team in the league has bad drafts just about every year, with the occasional great harvest.

Get on Reid’s ass for his bad game mgmt, playcalling, etc. But the draft? Not sure if that arguement sands up.

What we really, really have to get on Reid for is how on Earth he was convinced that MV and then VY were NFL calibre starting QBs.

paulman
paulman
December 6, 2011 11:46 am

Navy,
The NFL and Sports in general is about the present,about the here and now.
Does anyone really care what kind of a job Coach AR did from 1999-2010, for it really has bearing on what’s happening now in 2011,He has hired New Asssitants, new Players and New Schemes that he is ultimately responsible for and the game has changed somewhat from 10 years ago as has some of the Rules.. Coach AR has had his chances.. Fast forward to 2011 & beyond, he and his schemes have become stale and very predictable ..
Eagles are 14-14 over the last 2 Seasons and a pathetic 1-8 in their last 9 Home games, that’s right 1-8 in their last 9 Home Games.. How can anyone allow for this to happen…
Next Season their schedule is pretty difficult playing 2 superior Divisions in the NFC South (Saints,Falcons,Panthers & Bucs) and AFC North (Steelers,Ravens,Bengals,Browns) .. How are the Eagles going to compete with this Roster and Soft Defense playing these teams.. Next Season is a 6 or 6 Win season then a complete change will occur , meanwhile the Eagles will sleep-walk thruy the remainder of this Season which has been the worst performance for the most over-hyped team in Philly Sports History….

jakedog
jakedog
December 6, 2011 12:20 pm

if mike Vick played even close to expectations and not as a bottom third quarterback we wouldn’t be talking about Reid’s job security, the talk would be about the playoffs or a push to get in, this is now a quarterback driven league, and if you have a bad quarterback, nothing else matters, period.

nev856
nev856
December 6, 2011 12:31 pm

paulman i believe whole nfc east is spiraling downward , u could say that the whole division will suck next year.
and jake u r right vick and some other issues were better we are in the thick of it, only to lose to the saints or packers in an early round exit!

paulman
paulman
December 6, 2011 1:06 pm

hich brings me to the 2012 Season

With the Eagles likely have Draft Pick in the 6 to 10 Range, what should they address … There are lots of good QB’s in this 2012 Draft Class

Standord’s A Luck will most likely be the #1 Overall Pick
Oklhomas’s Landry Jones, USC M Barkely,Texas A&M R Tanneyhill,
Baylor’s Robert Griffin III, Oklahoma State’s Brandon Weeden…

Look at the sucess this Season of young QB who were thrown into the fire like A Dalton, C Newton and even C Ponder and Locker have given fans some reason to be excited about their future teams and seasons…

paulman
paulman
December 6, 2011 1:11 pm

i agree jack about Vick’s playing performance..
What were the expectations to begin with, for him to play at the unbelievable level that he was able to do for about 4-6 weeks last season in OCt & Nov or the Mike Vick who played 5-6 Years for the Flacons and here in lies the problem..
Too many fans Vick would play like he did during that golden time of 5-6 games when no one was quite sure how to defense against him since he was out of the League for 2 + Years.. Since last December and in his last 12 games or so, Vick has been very ordinary and a Turnover machine (as he was throughtout his Career) .. So misplaced hopes doomed this team from the Start in my opinion.. I am not a Vick hater, He’s exciting and fun to watch, but I never see him leading a Team to a Championship, he’s too risky with the ball and something that McNabb did have in his earlier years , was protecting that ball, in critical times of the game wher Vick just plays too reckless..

navyeaglefan
navyeaglefan
December 6, 2011 1:25 pm

Vinnie – Always loved Vancouver and you are starting to convince me that those lviing in the 51st state may actually be smarter then the people tht live in Philly = low valuation for the word excel – dude that is like GCOBB.com shuffle number 3 – just change the meaning of the word – that draft argument – come on man – you actually LOOKED at the rest of the NFL – all that type of ‘comparing’ must be done in a rabbit whole with a binary ‘superstar’ or ASS rating BEFORE the season even starts – don’t go getting rational and shit

SONGSRME2
SONGSRME2
December 6, 2011 1:29 pm

Navy, I know this going to hurt….Do the research again buddy.

Modrak set the draft board and worked on the draft, they gave him a package then they severed ties.

Lito, Sheldon, and Lewis came from the draft Modrak’s team scouted.

I know you might need to clean your crack pipe to understand teams actually scout picks and begin setting their boards while the season is in progress.

did you know that?

I remember it like it was yesterday….and yeah.

Modrak had a hand in the draft then they parted ways.

After Modrak’s drafts the defense got worse as his picks on the defensive side were low balled only to be replaced by bums.

Another thing…one guy people forget Reid inherited from from Ray Rhodes to man the middle was DT Thomas.

Reid inherited Thomas,Dawk, Trotter, Taylor, Vincent, Hugh Douglas, Carlos Emmons.

Look at the leadership in that bunch alone!!!!!!!

I remember the leaders being on the defensive side of the ball while Mcnabb was finding his way……That took pressure off of him which helped his maturation process.

The Eagles with Reid are personally responsible for not building on that nucleus.

Someone need to tell Reid…Schemes are important…but no scheme can excel with the players to execute the plays. exceptional players make plays even when the scheme faulters.

This defense lack the heart, playmaking, opportunistic grit the defense Reid inherited once had.

Who happened to those type of players?

Joe Banner and Andy Reid.

And I don’t ever want to hear again how our young talent need time. Why every other team’s high draft picks show promise early but we have to wait and see?

Earl Thomas…is anyone out ther saying wait and see on him? What about Pierre Paul?

Our early round drafts on defensive talent sucks ass and are less productive than our 5th to 7th rounders, who are also substandard talent. I hope Lurie see this and do something once and for all.

Hell, Bring in some HEART!!!!!

It seems any player challenges the status quo, wanting to win, Reid and Banner cut them or let them walk.

Bring back HEART!!!

T.O. was right!!!! He had heart and you wouldn’t pay him.

Dawk, was right! He had heart and you wouldn’t pay him.

Now, you are going to let DJax go because he care and wear his heart on his sleeve, was knocked out of games with concussions for this team only to see out siders get paid after he single-handedly saved our season last year against the Giants with no time left on the clock.

Vick gets 100 million dollar deal and he gets nothing!!!!!

DJax got heart but this organization don’t respect what this little guy have brought to Philly. HEART!

Say what you want about him not risking another concussion for this organization!

They have shown their 2 time pro bowler that they will not risk, so why should he?

you pay him minimal and you get what you pay for in a capitalistic society. If you respect what he have brought to this team and his big play ability, pay him and he won’t preserve his health for a new contract.

I’m so tired of this FO and Reid doing this to every super star who put on the Green.

We need a change….DJax should get paid and Andy and rosbud should go.

Bring Modrak back so we can get some damn defensive talent in here and hire a damn defensive coordinator.

jakedog
jakedog
December 6, 2011 1:29 pm

well then Andy hitched his wagon to the wrong horse and maybe deserves what appears to be his fate if that’s true, but even if Vicks play was adequate, if he learned how to read the blitz, how to throw the ball away, how to protect the ball, how to manage the game like it appeared he did against Dallas, to stop playing reckless to avoid injury, bullshit, he hurt his ribs if at all on a running play, if Michael Vick just played the quarterback position the eagles would be in the playoffs and Reid’s job would be secure