• August 17, 2022

Is Charlie Manuel Doing A Good Job?

We are about 40% through the baseball season. This is about the time where it’s just not a bad start anymore, and your team may have some problems.

Locally, the big question is will the Phillies be buyers or sellers at the trade deadline ? As of today they sit in the basement of the N.L. East, seven games behind the Washington Nationals. But even more important, they are behind three other teams.

I understand everyone wants action, but the first thing you have to do is identify the problem. Someone said this week “How are they expected to win playing subs every night? How can you win with guys like Luna, Orr, and Fontenot playing?”

Let me tell you about another team. This team has injuries as well. Yesterday their line up had names like Herrera, Rivera, Ellis, and Castellanos. Looks more like your co-ed intramural team that played Jimmy Wong’s sushi shack this week. But this team is 38-22, and leads their division. Part of the reason they are succeeding is they have a manager that understands situational baseball, and puts his team in a position to win more often.

That team is the Los Angeles Dodgers, and that manager is Don Mattingly. Charlie Manuel is a lovable guy. He has decades of experience in the game. He was as popular as Godzilla and David Hasselhoff when he played in Japan. He is admired by his players. All that being said, why does that mean he is the best man for the job? Why does that mean that he is more qualified then you or I? Because he has been around the game longer? All that experience didn’t teach him after the seventh inning in a tie game when the lead off man gets on  second, you should consider bunting him over to third base?

The Phillies also have a lead-off hitter that should be hitting eighth. Manuel lets his personal feelings get in the way of a baseball decision that should have seen this done two years ago. Rollin’s .244 average this year is one thing, but it’s the .292 On-base percentage that has me scratching my head. What is it going to take for this manager to make this move to improve this team?

Over the last three years Rollins has a .251 Batting average with a .313 on-base percentage, one of the lowest in baseball. Sure injuries have played a huge role in the team’s current demise . I could go back and pull out at least four games that were decided by situations that shouldn’t have happened if the team was better coached. I like Charlie Manuel but he has to go. If you are blaming injuries on this year, what is the excuse for the past three years ? Arguably one of the top 20 teams talent wise ever assembled with a top five pitching staff,  the team has been on a steady decline since 2008.

Everyone remembers 2008, the year we didn’t have any $20 Million dollar a year players. We have just added expensive pieces when other teams rebuild. In fact Texas has lost their number one starter to free agency each of the last three years yet has got better . Also could the Cole Hamels situation be handled any worse?

Cole Hamels is the biggest reason that we have our world championship. He’s 28 years old. Give him his seven-year deal and build around him. Do not let him walk because you made one of the biggest mistakes in MLB history giving Ryan Howard his contract.

From a national perspective I can’t forget listening to ESPN a month ago and hearing their baseball “experts” say the Angels were finished. At the time they were eight games out of the lead. It was the beginning of May. These guys are experts? Eight games has been made up in three weeks, just look at our beloved Phillies a few years back. I take what goes to print very serious. I want to be the best at what I do no matter what it is. I put my time in. I form my own opinions and I make sure they came from an educated stance. ESPN is one of the channels I watch. But for those of you who are hard core baseball people like myself the MLB network does a great job at covering the game. I won’t change my World Series prediction like most. I’m sticking by my original Giants-Angels call. Neither team is in first place, but I think both still have the capability to win. If you take out the teams currently leading their divisions, St. Louis, San Francisco and Atlanta look like they still could make a run. All have good pitching and have decent lineups.

Current MVP Leaders

National League: Joey Votto, .362 BA  .484 On base %  .643 Slugging %  10HR 38 RBI  26 2b

American League: Josh Hamilton, .338BA   .395 On Base % .699 Slugging %  22 HR 59 RBI 13 2b


Current Cy Young Leaders

National League:  Gio Gonzalez, 8-2 2.35 ERA

American League: David Price, 8-3 2.40 ERA


Charles Bowles

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  • they ryan howard deal was bad? did i miss something? He has won or been in the top 5 of mvp voting like 4 times in 6 years…. I should write that sentence a few more times! He has averaged 136 rbi’s a year for his 6 years as a starter! 136!!!!!! last time i checked rbi’s were very important to the outcome of a game.

  • Last time I checked contracts were paid for performance going forward. So what you are saying is we should have rewarded Howard with 125 Million for his past numbers ? What has he done since ? Fact is he hasn’t come close to those MVP numbers and even healthy won’t again. The Phillies are stuck with a guy who’s body already is breaking down. Granted he is a good player. But he i snot a 25 MM a year player. So stop looking pre contract, start looking post contract

  • contracts are always given based on past performance? what are you talking about… haven’t you heard ‘playing for a contract’ or ‘its a contract year so the player is trying to put up good numbers’…. ?
    how come the angels gave pujos all that money for 10 years…do you really think that in years 6-10 he’s going to be putting up numbers like he’s done for the last 10 years?
    tearing an achilles is not a sign of a body breaking down. degeniritive knees (utly) is a sign that the body is breaking down.

  • The Deal with Charlie is that he’s likes to set his everyday Regular-lineup type of guy and forget it..He is not very good at utilizing his 25 Man Roster. He is not very good at managing “Small-Ball” type of Baseball (which this 2012 Phillie Roster is) Roster) and he is not strong in Managing a Bullpen, so I don’t really blame him for the make-up of the 2012 Team is not condusive to how he manages which is to throw the same 8 guys out there every day and swing hard and for the fences and to take his chances that his guys will outfight you and win their fair share of games.. It’s been his motto his entire Career and it’s the way he Manage’s and with the injuries
    I believe a big problem is that the GM and Charlie Manuel have not been on the same page since the end of last Season and during the off-season when the Roster was being put together.. Charlie is extremely loyal (like Coach AR and sometimes to a fault..) I bet J Rollins was resigned by the Phils due to Charlie pushing Amaro..
    As Far As Howard Goes, He’ll be fine in 2013 and still have 3-4 Productive Seasons ahead of him.. Phls need to updgrade 2B,3B,LF and Bullpen moving forward..

  • The problem sits in th front office! You can blame the injuries & you can blame Charlies decisions all you want, but you can’t shine a turd! Amaro managed to to take a WS winning team, with $94,302,380M payroll, to regress each & every year, while raising the payroll close to $177M. The minor leagues are barren & devoid of any position players. The big club is ancient, injury prone, lacking talent, & are full of journeymen & borderline major leaguers. Amaro did NOTHING, to supplement, or infuse any young talent on this team. NOTHING! You can’t continue to make the oldest team in MLB, that’s injury prone, & make it even older & injury prone, & expect them to miraculously recover, & compete for a Championship. His player analysis, of bringing in FA’s have been atrocious & if he didn’t have his double agent (Wade), working for the Astros, we would have made no trades, that helped. Amaro needs to be fired & this team needs a major overhaul & change of philosophy. Although, IMHO, it isn’t his fault, I’m not against replacing Charley with Sandberg, either. We are done. There is no magic pill, Howard & Utley are not the saviours, & we have ZERO salary space, to fill all of the holes we have. Even if Howard, Utley, do miraculously recover, we still 2 bats & we need at least 2 BP pieces. THEY ARE DONE!

  • Charles, I agree 100% The Howard contract was an undeserved, ill-timed, monumental mistake. There was no reason, nor rush, to give him that contract. He had 2 years still under contract. ALBATROSS, THAT IS UN-TRADEABLE, & THAT WAS BEFORE HIS FAT @$$ BLEW OUT HIS ACHILLIES!!!!

  • howards HR totals and RBI totals over the last 6 years are better than adrian gonzolez and mark teixera and prince fielder who signed for 9 years and is 300 lbs!
    they gave him a fair contract– bunch of arm chair qb’s who whine when things aren’t going right.
    nothing to infuse young talent? hmmm lets see pence in right and mayberry in left. mayberry is not working out but the front office is giving him a shot based on 15 hr’s and a .275 BA in 100 games last year. so now i guess you genius’ don’t think that he deserved a shot? stutes and bastardo came from the farm system as did worley…thats 5 young players right there… oh and galvis—
    you need journeymen on your team to contribute. the cardinals won the world series with journeymen

  • Are you kidding me, you want to blast Charlie for this season, yet give no praise to him for when the phils won it in ’08 with a substantially reduced payroll, the problem with this team is amaro and his failure to adress power outages at third, left field, left field hasn’t been addressed since Burrell, I know only one hit in series (a big one though), but he was a force in that every day lineup, high obs, amaro has built team of pitching in a hitters park, poorly constructed, but this nerd bowen wants to pick on charlie

  • in 2008 the phils scored 4.9 runs a game and gave up 4.1. Thats a difference of .8 every game. In 2011 with that too much pitching (that never gets old) team they scored 4.4 and gave up 3.2 a difference of 1.2 per game. the idea is to score more than you give up, regardless of the park
    as for replacing burrell…. for his career over a 162 game season burrells numbers were: .253, 29 HR, 96 RBI and OB% of .361– Ibanez .280, 24HR, 93 RBI and OB% of .341…. sounds like amaro brought in a pretty good complimentary player.

  • Ibanez not the same presence in the line up as Burrell, and how about running the numbers on the 2012 edition

  • Also, the last 5 WS champs this is the starting 3B HR numbers–10, 13, 30 (A.Rod), 14 (Feliz) and 21
    3B is a traditional power position but if you don’t have power there you have to supply it somewhere else… obviously that somewhere else until he bacame a cripple was Utley, Also Jimmy earlier in his career.
    Besides the injuries I think a big part of the power outage is LF…. Mayberry has not stepped up– they gave him a shot to be a player but looks like it won’t happen.

  • HAC, stop your pom-pom waving, & think in reality. Mayberry is a career minor league bum, & Hunter Pence I do like. BTW, GENIUS, both of them are 29 years old, & are NOT CONSIDERED YOUNG TALENT. He added ZERO young talent to this lineup & if you have read any of my posts, you would know that’s what I’ve referring to. All of our top prospects are pitchers. Our farm system has ZERO GOOD position prospects, anywhere close. Even the ones that were traded, are nobodies. The only position prospect that is worth anything, is C d’Arnaud. Our minor league system has been horrific, since Wade & Arbuckle left. STOP DEFENDING AMARO! HE IS INDEFENSIBLE!

  • jake you are a wonderful second guesser. All i’m saying is that Amaro has done a good job of finding complimentary players– this year 2 major cogs have been out. He knew howard was out and got a decent temp replacement in wiggington and nix… he couldn’t get much more than that for obvious reasons.
    2012 is a terrible year — they’ve scored 4.2 runs a game and given up 4.2–thats a full run a game MORE given up than last year–
    and you know ruben will re-tool during the off season– he makes the moves and doesn’t have the luxury of waiting to see how it will work out before making the decision.– they went with mayberry– he deserved a shot– bad decision… i guess so but what was your solution?

  • you said “young talent on THIS TEAM”– to me thats the phils…
    Mayberry is 28 until december– and a 28-29 year old should have 5-7 more good years so in BB age its fairly young.

  • If Mayberry keeps playing the way he has this season, he will be out of Baseball by the time he’s 30 Years old and be blogging on SPorts Sites like the rest of us..He really missed a great opportunity this Season to nail down an everyday Spot for the Phillies..
    I will agree with “Have a Cigar” on Amaro finding suitable bench and role players..Where he is messing up is paying too much for older in house players.. Re-signing players like Howard,Utley,Rollins,Blanton to big Contracts ..When you look are his record of bringing in players from the Outside like Ibanez,Polanco,Lee,Oswlat at failry high salaries, It’s hard to say that they players lived up to those high expectations and high salries….
    It’s a tough job he has, but signing Players to anything longer than 3-4 Years is rolling the dice and re-signing players are in already in their 30’s to very large deals is just poor business.. Ruben should have studied the “Joe Banner” Salary Management Chapter a little closer..

  • He paid Howard at 29 and didn’t overpay. Same with utley . As for signing for more than 3 or4 years you have to consider what the market dictates. He has to deal with the realities of the business not the second guessing of the blogosphere

  • Howard is not worth $20-22 Million Per Season, he just isnt…
    Utle’s production has declined big time since the 2009 Season and he has not lived up to his $15 Million Salary the last 3 Seasons… Take your Philies Blinders off Cigar and look at the reality of this Team.. They are stuck with lots of bad contract for overpaid, aging players.. WHose to blame.. I don’t blame a player to getting great deals like Jimmy Rollins did this past off-seaons.. There wasn’t even a handful of teams that were even interested in Signing him… Yuo really think Rollins is worh $11 Million per Season for the next 3 Seasons at his stage of his Career.. Screw wqhat the market says, know your team, develop your younger players and upsgrade your roster with younger players with more upside as the aging players start fall apart …

  • So GM Paul you would not have signed utley in 2007 or 08? You would have let a 28 year old all star who hit 300 with 30 home runs walk. Good move … They got him relatively cheap

  • $15 Million was big bucks for Utley then, I would have signed him, but not to a 6 Year Deal.. 3 Year Deals Max is all I would sign any players for… How productive and effective are Doc & Lee going to be come 2014 ..
    Last Off-Season, I would have offered nad signed Hamels for a 3 Year Deal for $55 Milion, then when Contract is up at age 30-31, Hamels could still get a big Contract by someone, Obviously, If he continued to Pitch well in 2013/2014 then I would sign him again..
    WHy extend Howard when he was already under a godo contract, they could have waiting a year or 2 to see waht he produces and then extend his deal, just because you Win a WS doesn’t mean every player of your Roster gets signed to a 4-5-6 Year Deal.. and now in 2012, the Phils are paying the Price for they have too many old,often injured players who are on the downside of the Career.. Lots of these players like Rollins aren’t that old, but he’s played in lots of games, endures long series, deep playoff runs, playiong the INternational tournament a few years back.. .

  • Have you seen the deals other comparable players sign? You are not realistic in the market. You are being silly and playing with monopoly money and in monopoly terms. Who would have been your first baseman while winning 102 games last year….
    You are playing monopoly….

  • Look at whats happening with Hamels now that they didnt extend him a year or two ago,i cant blame amaro for locking howard up,thats what youre supposed to do when you have a hof caliber player on your team.

  • What makes me angry is when people keep saying you cant break up the teams because the fans will be angry.You have to do whats best for the organizations future and you cant worry about what the fans think.I belive the phillies should try rebulding on the fly and start getting rid of most of the roster.

  • It takes two to sign a contract. Utley would have walked. The year he signed he hit 313 with 32 hr and 132 runs…. How anyone would think he would sign a 3 year deal…. Must be smoking the good stuff

  • That being said I would try to trade Hamels and then resign him in the offseason.Hamels and Victorino to the Orioles for Dylan Bundy would be a great start.Open up enough salary to bring in Josh Hamilton is what I think we should be focused on.The game has shifted to more pitching so I think its harder to develop great hitters than it is to develop great pitching.

  • List of Players probably not on the Phils Roster next Season
    Hamels,Victorino,Polanco, Mayberry Jr, Pierre,Schneider, Blanton,Conteras,Qualls..
    Phils would be smart to to trade Hamels and Victorino at Trade Deadline and
    get some prospects back in return and then pick-up2 Stud Players players in Free-agency next off-season once clearing some $$$ off the Payroll..

  • HAC, you can come up with all of your BS, & pom-pom waving, team spin all you want, but you are WRONG! BTW, who was talking about the Utley signing? I didn’t. I was talking about Howard. I’m so sick of the blind loyalists like you, that are unable to look at the reality of things. You are so stubborn & stupidly delusional to see the truth of things. Get your head out of you rear end, man! The cycle of this team is done, & we have ZERO, good young replacements on the horizon. AMARO HAS DONE A PISS POOR JOB, OF PUTTING TOGETHER A GOOD YOUNGER ROSTER & PREPARING THIS TEAM FOR FUTURE CONTINUITY! PERIOD, END OF STORY! All of your BS, excuses & delusions, are not going to change those facts!

  • Also, genius, if they didn’t extend Howards contract, it wouldn’t matter, because he still would have been under contract, last year. His original contract wasn’t up until the end of last season. He was going to be up for FA, the same time as Pujols, Fielder & Votto (signed an extension early last season). So that’s your answer for who would have been our 1st basemen last year. At 30 years old, Howard will make $20 million this year, being on the DL & 2013, $25 million annually from 2014-2016. The Phillies have a $23 million club option for 2017 with a $10 million buyout. AS I SAID, MONUMENTAL MISTAKE!!! So you don’t have a clue, of what you speak, Stepford.

  • Paul who would you sign for ‘no more than 3 years’? You don’t live in the real world. They have a name for teams that don’t sign players to long term deals…it’s the Oakland A’s
    This team is essentially the same as the team that won 102 games last year. Amaro built a team that can win….102 games did anyone watch that, yes they got beat by a team that got hot but that is sport

  • DC so because you say its a mistake that makes it so? you have to look at the market and giving him ONLY 5 years was a huge bonus to the phils comprable players have signed for 8-10 years at the same money
    paulman is the one that mentioned he only would have singed utley to 3 year deal and ALL players to no more than 3-4 year deals– you can’t do that. The market dictates

  • ^PHIL..LIES PHIL..LIES SISS BOOM BAH, AMARO AMARO RAH RAH RAH Don’t you get it! He was in decline & they signed him with 2 years left on his original contract! THERE WAS ZERO REASON TO RE-SIGN him yet, ESPECIALLY WHEN, AT THE TIME, PUJOLS (same age), FIELDER (5 years younger) & VOTTO (3 years younger), WERE COMING OFF OF THE BOOKS THE SAME TIME. If they didn’t re-sign him, the injury, wouldn’t have mattered & we could have signed either Pujols, or Fielder instead. WHO I WOULD TAKE 99 out of 100 TIMES OVER HOWARD! NO MATTER HOW MUCH THEY GOT! Pujols is a HOF, & has been one of the best hitters in the game, & Fielder is also comparable to Howard, but better in all facets of the game. THE CONTRACT, WAS ILL-ADVISED & ILL-TIMED! NO MATTER HOW YOU TRY TO SPIN IT!

  • votto signed for 13 years jerk… he will be 41 when they are still paying him. puljos will be 42 i think when the angels are paying him…fielder will be 350 lbs. in about 2 more years… and compare howards numbers to fielder..go to baseball-reference.com
    puljos may be the BEST (top 5) players EVER– so he is a different story from ANYONE.
    i guess amaro gets no credit for building a team that won 102.
    also, with howard in the lineup they won 102 and a w.s… without him they are 9.5 back…
    you general manage like an idiot…. completely clueless as to what the market is… CLUELESS!

  • Who cares if other Teams like the Reds,Angeles overextended big Contracts to their Star players.. This doesn’t mean the PHils have to do the same thing..
    Look at teh Dodgers, extended younger players who are just hitting their primes with reasonable 5 year deals like Kershaw,Kemp, and the recently signed Kershaw, next off-season, they will Sign Cole Hamles and probably dominate the NL for the next 5 years like the Phils did from 2008-2011..
    This is another reason I would trade Hamels to an AL teams (Boston/Yanks/Anaheim) and keep Hamles from signing with the Dodgers..
    Lots of moving parts as usual..

  • Last year was last year HAC…
    Winning a 102 games is a great achievement, even though the NL EAst was one of the weakest Divisisions and in the end, really didn’t mean much since they lost to SL Cardinals who scraped just to get nito the Playoffs with 15 less wins.. Teams like the Dodgers,Giants,Reds were all big dissapointments in 2011 just like the Phils,Brewers have been in 2012..
    This 2012 is not as mentally tough as years past and the Phils Bullpen is among the worst in the NL.. Unless their Starter goes 7-8 Innings (which is still not a guarantee of a win with their anemic,lack of power line-up) they have no chance of winning many games.. It is what it is.. Everyone will look back and blame the Injuries to Utley,Howard and now Doc, I say that’s bunk and that this Phillie Team was not very good to begin with and have been consistent with this since the Off-Season and also stated many,many times that the remainder of the NL East Teams that the Phils have wupped on over the last few years were much improved and of course, many of you laughed, when I mentioned the Nats as legitimate Contendors and I still say as a follower of Baseball, the Nats are the most Talented Team in the NL East and will be a force for the next 4-5 Seasons as will the Marlins & Braves…
    I have to be honest, I did not expect much from the NY Mets and did not see them having this kind of success

  • That’s what the Phil’s did with utley and the point is that is the market. Stud players in their late 20’s or 30 get long deals that is the way it works. You guys complain about it but to compete you lock up your players. As you said earlier lock cole up for 3 years 55 mill… Cole would not have agreed to that…it takes two to sign

  • Kemp is 8 years 160 mill, either 6 years 95 mill Keyshawn is 2 years but he hasn’t even reached arbitration years yet. So moreroof about the market and continued GM Paul with no rules
    Utley and Howard were in their prime and signed market value contracts. The fact that they only gave Howard 5 years is amazingly short for a player of his caliber

  • Wasn’t Howard already 30 Years old when he signed his extension, while Kemp was 26/27 when he received his Extension..
    What DCar and many others have complained about Howard’s deal is that he was already under a deal with 2 years remaning and it wasn’t like they needed to extend his deal at that time.. Howard was not in a contract year or Free-agencty type of sitautions so he wasn’t going anywhere..Similar situation with Joe Blanton’s Deal who was already under contract and then Phils extended him for 4 more Years a $9 Million per Season after 1 decent Season.. These are the type of Managing a Roster/Team Salary structure blunders that come back to haunt you and tie your hands later on about making other moves..

    Cigar, you need to attend “Paulman’s GM Wanna-Be School” in FLorida next Off-Season, I will foward you a $50 Coupon Off for Christmas.. Enjoy

  • HAC, you go re-read baseball reference. Their states are almost a carbon copy. Go back to 2005- NOW! YOU DO NOT, KNOW WHAT YOU’RE TALKING ABOUT!!!! You DO NOT lock up 90% of your team with albatross contracts, when they are already ancient. Especially with no means of infusing good young talent, to this team. The farm is barren, & NO ONE will give us any good, MLB ready prospects, with any of the garbage we have in return. You are delusional & don’t know WTF you’re talking about. It’s clear to me, that you are an excuse making, stepford, organizational, spin master, apologist. YOU ARE WRONG! DEAL WITH IT! I’M DONE WITH YOU!

  • You make stuff up…kemp was 8 not 5 you make up numbers to make a point. I use real numbers, read the cba…these are things that wannabe bloggers should do to make their point. The dodgers who you used as an example are doing exactly what the Phil’s did a few years back…locking up their core. EXACTLY what the Phil’s did

  • D car you were unclear or illiterate… What happened in 2005?

  • Dodgers are locking up their Core Players who are still 26/27/28 years old (Kemp,Ethier,Kershaw,Billingsly,etc,etc)
    Phils locked up players like Howard who was 30 Years old, Polanco and Ibanez 32 and 34 years of age..J Rollins with another big deal at 33 years of age and of course committed Starting Pitchers with 20+ Million Deals to Doc & Lee who are in their early to 30’s.. that’s a big difference and then the
    Phils do jack about locking up 27 Year old Cole Hamels who is in his Prime and has a good 5-7 years left at the minimum.. Explain that one to us …

  • To Cigar,
    I have rescinded my $50 Off Coupon for you to Attend the Paulman’s GM Wanne-Be Symposium next Febuary in Florida.. I have very few availalbe spots open and would rather have students,baseball enthusiast’s attend who know what their talking about or at least are willing to learn..

  • Keershaw is not locked up for long only 2 years…the reason is because he wouldn’t commit. Utley was in his 20’s and howard 30 so you are on record as saying doc and lee were bad signings? They and Howard were not responsible for any of the success they have had?
    Ether is also 30 when he signed his 6 year extension
    As for cole, remember it takes two to sign long term. The Phil’s took care of him with 1 and 2 yr contracts like the dodgers are doing with kershaw

  • HeY cigar, ever since you started this defense of amaro’s moves the Phil have gone in a tailspin, from 3 1/2 tO 91/2, for the love of god, please stop already

  • Yes I am a believer that the Contracts for both Doc & Lee were not in the best long term interest of the Team and will look even worse come 2013 & 2014 and 2015 as they become older and probably become middle of the road Pitchers due to older age,injuries, which becomes expected.. These Guys Pitching 220 Innings in a Season are over.. Don’t get me wrong, they will still will be quality Pitchers capable of Winning 15-17 Games a Season if they can get some offensive suppot.. Problem is you have to address the Offense too (and not by adding the Jim Thomes, Juan Pierre’s of the MLB) and to keep thinking or hoping that Utley is going to return to 2007/2008 form
    You have to strike a good balance of PItchign,Bullpen and HItting and since the PHils play at CBP, I think they have short-changed their Offense the last 2 Off-seasons and now we are seeing the results of have an everyday line-up composed on players who cannot take advantaage on playing in the Hitters Park.. Even when Howard reutrns and is 100% by 2013, what’s the Status of Utley, Rollins is another year older, Victorino gone free-agnecy, Polanco gone with his contract up, Who else besides Pence & Ruiz are goign to support HOward moving forward..

  • Paul… So long term interest means the entire roster last year should have been in their 20’s? Of course they won’t be as good as they age just like every other player in the game….but you have to do it to have a chance.

  • Their easy pitching and light tilting offense was 63 and 19 in a hitters park. Duh
    I know since I’ve defended Ruben they’ve sucked… I’m shooting for them being 15 games out at the deadline and watching my boy as a seller!

  • Long term in SPorts is 3 Years.. Planning/SIgning Players for your Roster longer than that is rolling the dice, A superstar Player is the exception and you should lock them up when you have a chance.. but remember a couple of things..
    #1) Power Hitting 1B ‘s are a dime a dozen, (there’s 20 of them in the MLB)
    #2) Power Hitting/Producing 2B/3Bs’ are harder to find and develop (Phils have nither in Galvis,Polanco,Martinez,Orr)
    #3) All Glove but No-HIt SS are a dime a dozen (do you really need to spend $33.5 Million over the next 3 Seasons for the aging J Rollins)
    #4) You need more Power Production from your OF Corps, Phils have Pence and that’s it.. Victorino’s a slap-hitting OF’s who is a consistent player with a little pop, but I beleive he will be looking ot get a $10-$12 Million Deal which the Phils won’t go fo so they will be in the market for a CF next season and really see Dom Brown being called up to replace him when Victorino gets traded this upcoming trade dealine, Phils could probably get some decent prospects for Victorino since he is one of the few players with actual Trade Value

    Look at Cardinals Roster last year, a good mix of younger and older players, same with the SF Giants the year before and even when the Phil won in 2008, they had a some Veterans, but mostly have players in their primes in their late 20’s maybe 30 but not the amount of older players that the have now…

  • Of course that is why pence, Mayberry were brought in for youth. Cards had two 28 year olds starting and a few 32 and a geezer. That’s what the Phil’s tried. Remember everyone sai, don’t get too far behind without Howard…he is the big piece…that much is obvious

  • I agree with most of what you said Pman except for Victorino. You don’t need to have power production out of your CF especially when that player can score 100 runs and steal 30 bags like he can. The problem with this year and last year is that he can’t get into the right spot in the order for him which is 1 or 2. He is also an excellent defensive OF.

    The power has to come from the corner OF and corner IF spots. Problem is that the Phils have no power coming from LF, 3B or 1B right now.

    Because of the Lee deal and the need to sign Hamels, he will probably go. Wow, this team could actually be worse next year if Hamels/Victorino are gone. Even with Howard at 100%.

  • I agree That Victorino is a good consistent players who plays excellent Defense, steals bases and bats .280-.290 every season and can pop 15 HR’s
    But with his Contract up and he is in the prime years of his career with the Chance for 1 big contract, I doubt he’s going to accopt what the Phils will offer.. I believe he will be looking for $10-12 MIllion per Season type of Deal (4 Year Deal for $42-46 Million Range) and I don’t beleive the Phils will spend that type of $$ for him and at his age and current Salary, The Phils could get some decent players/propects for him since they realyl don’t have too many tradeable pieces based on their Contracts,Age and No-Trade clauses…

  • Pence is in his Prime and a porven everyday MLB Player, the Jury is still out on Mayberry though.. I believe when Victorino gets traded by Trade Dealine that Mayberry will play CF and Dom Brown will be called up to Play LF and when the Phils are facing tough Right-Handed PItchers, the Phils will Start Juan Pierre in LF & Dom Brown in Center and Mayberry will come in off the Bench

  • Brown seems to be responding since they moved him to CF. I would like to see him there with Mayberry/Pierre in LF.

    Really what do they have to lose. 10 effin games out and the Nats just swept the Jays.

  • Right but they had to give Mayberry a shot based on his 100 games last year

  • I agree with that HAC. And this platooning with other players is not giving him a shot. He needs to play everyday. With Pierre hitting so well, it has to be at 1B.

    I say bring up all the kids you want to take a look at. How much worse can they be than Fontenot, Wigginton and Thome (at this point in his career).

  • Nats are on fire and just wait until Mike Morse gets his swing back after missing the 1st 2months of the Season. They can keep young Bryce Harper up p and don’t even need Jason Werth any longer..
    As I stated all off-Season, the Nats have the most talented 25 Man Roster in the NL East and are proably just a step below the Dodgers and Cardinals for overall talent in the NL…
    Look at future seasons versis the NAts

    1B – A LaRoche – 32 Yeasrs Old
    2B – D Espinosa – 25 Years Old
    SS – I Desmond – 26 Years Old
    3B – R Zimmerman – 27 Years Old
    C – W Ramos – 24 Years Old (out for Season)
    C – J Flores – 26 Years Old (replaced Ramos as Primart Catcher)

    LF – M Morse – 30 Years Old
    CF – R Bernadina 28 years Old
    RG – B Harper – 19 Years old
    Reserve S Lombardozzi – 23 Years Old
    Reserve R Ankiel 32 Years Old
    Reserve X Nady 32 Years Old
    Injured J Werth 33 Years Old

    Starting PItchers
    Steven Strasberg – 23 Years Old
    Gio Gonzales – 26 Years Old (The Best Acquistion in the entire MLB las off-season)
    Jordan Zimmerman – 26 Years Old
    Ross Detweiler – 26 Years Old
    Edwin Jackson – 28 Years Old
    C-Ming Wang – 32 Years Old

    Relief Pitchers
    T Clippard – 27 Years Old
    S Burnett – 29 Years Old
    D Sotren – 24 Years Old (injured, one of Baseballs Best Closer’s))
    C Stamman – 28 Years Old
    T Gorzelanny – 29 Years Old
    B Lidge – 35 Years Old (under a 1 year deal)
    M Gonzales – 34 Years Old
    H Rodriquez – 25 Years Old (Injured)
    R Mattheus – 28 Years Old (Injured)

    I would say their GM has done an excellent job of putting some Veteran Players around some young talent together with an agressive style of Managing led by Davy Johnson. The Nats are built to win not only for this Season but for futre Seasons.. Their up the middle players of Catcher Ramos, 2B Espinosa and SS Desmon may be the best threesome of young players in the middle of the IF in all of Baseball in my opinion who have barely scratched the surface.. It’s a shame that Catcher Ramos blew out his knee for he has a very bright future and reminds many of Catcher Molina from the Cardinals
    Bottom line, the Nats will be a force for the Phillies to reckon with besides the usual Braves and upsrtart Marlins and Mets too..

  • Paulman, stugots with that breakdown, you sound like some nat fan, I have told you and will tell you again the nats will falter, but please no more have a cigar exchanges it spells doom

  • I have no strong feelings about the NAtionals, but I do like how they’ve gone out and put a quality roster together, I liked their free-agent signings to add quality Vetreans mixed in wtith their home grown talent.. remember the Phils used to do this.. too many of you so called hils Fans don’t follow the sport that closely outsdie of what the Phils are doing and believe,me there are lots of Teams are their way up and the NAtionals are oneo f them.. Phils Future (short-term and long-tem) does not look better tan a .500 Team.. Phils coule very well finish inthe basement and with a $175 Million Teamayroll… This is a joke, IF the Phils went on purge and salary cost deal, I could understand, but paying some of these players on their Roster the amount they are paying is assaine and no one held a gun to their heads and sya Pay Joe Blanton $10 Million per Season, or Jimmy Rollins $11 Million per season only to find out that they don’t want to pay the $$ to retain Hamels (whose fading by the way and realizes his future with the Phils is over and will most likley be average the rest of he Season)

  • HAC, I SAID GO LOOK AT ALL OF THEIR STATS SINCE 2005! Their stats are almost carbon copy. Pujols are better. Fielders are very similar. As for me being illiterate, I’ve forgotten more about sports & life, than you could ever hope to attain, SON! “SO GO GET YOUR F^#@ING SHINE BOX!” PLEASE STOP ALREADY, with your fact-less, baseless, ill-informed, idiotic defense, & pom-pom waving of this team & FO. YOU DO NOT KNOW OF WHAT YOU SPEAK! You’ve embarrassed yourself enough, quit before you bury yourself even more. YOU ARE WRONG! PERIOD!!! AMARO DID A BAD JOB!!! IT IS NOT DEFENSIBLE!!!! YOU ARE AN IDIOT! STFU ALREADY!!!!

  • jake, there is nothing worse than a stubborn, rock headed, pom-pom waving blind loyalist, like HAC! This dude just doesn’t get it! He needs to just STFU already. All of the spin, BS & excuses he is spewing, is completely ridiculous, & fact-less! He must be Amaro’s Nephew, or something. He fails to realize, that the 102 Wins last year, means Stugots, when you get bounced in the first round. That makes them one of the biggest disappointments, in the history of this city. Especially with all of the preseason hype & praise, that they have gotten prior to the season. That was a disgrace & embarrassment, & to go into this season, unprepared, & made even older & overpaid, is unforgivable. He did a piss poor job, & needs to be fired. Anyone that defends him, or anyone else in this organization, is a f^#@ing idiot. Sorry if the truth hurts, but this cycle, & Championship ERA is over & needs to be rebuilt ASAP, if we want to compete at a high level again!

  • Final NL East Standings for 2012
    1) Nationals 91-71
    2) Braves 88-74
    3) Mets 83-77
    4) Marlins 81-81
    5) Phitn’ Phils 79-83

  • Car you idiot I said pulls is in a league by himself possibly best player ever! You can’t compare anyone with him! But he won’t be that great at 42 but you have to pay extraordinary talent. Paul as for the nationals they have done a great job but we do know that they overpaid for werth . It happens. You guys think no one else signs players long term.
    And. At Blanton signed 3 years 24 mill that I’d average of 8 mill. Again you and paiul make stuff up
    So geniuses the two best free agents this year are wright (if mets don’t pick up option) and Hamilton how much and how long would you sign them for

  • Fair point about Wright and Hamilton. Some team is going to overpay for these guys, because there is no one else out there.

  • To CIGAR
    According to ESPN list of Phillie Salaries, Blanton is making $10,500,000 in 2012.. and no doubt the Nats overpaid for Werth, but when trying to change from a losing culture to a winning culture, some Teams will have to overpay initally to attract other good players..
    A player I have really liked over the last 2 years who I wanted to Phils to pursure was Adam Jones of the Orioles who just signed a big extension with the Orioles for 6 years for $85 Million I believe, but again, Jones is just hitting his prime and is only 26 years old who is still improving

  • Form the Phils site:

    Blanton will make $1 million in 2010, but he also receives a $6 million signing bonus. That will be paid in $3 million installments in June and October. Blanton will earn $8.5 million in ’11 and ’12. He also has escalator clauses, which states he will make $8.75 million in ’11 if he throws 200 innings in ’10, and $8.75 million in ’12 if he throws 200 innings in ’11.

    Would have loved to have Jones in red pinstripes.

  • Paul, heed my advice, quit while your ahead, with that @$$clown. Save your breath. He’s a lost cause. He lacks the mental capacity, to see the truth, through the pinstripe glasses, that he wears. We both have tried to reason with him, with facts, truths & events that have & are taking place, but he is too deluded & close minded to understand! Don’t worry, REALITY will eventually fall on him like a ton bricks. He has the balls to call me an idiot, when he has been wrong on every single thing, he made a comment about. He’s a hopeless, pom-pom waving, blindly loyal, stepford, that can’t think reality, or be reasoned with.

  • Thnx for the info Bugs.. I just went to the ESPN Team Salaries for that $10.5 Figure. I guess either way you slice it.. Blanton is not worth 1/2 of his contract, I think we can all agree with this..

  • Absolutely agree.

    Phils will have 118.5 Mil committed to: Lee, Doc, Howard, Utley, Paps, J-roll, Kendrick and Ruiz next season.

    Pence has one more year of arb, but I think that they lock him up to stay. If they sign him to another arb type deal, he will probably make 10-12 mil next year.

    Bastardo, Worley and Galvis are all making around 500k and these guys should be resigned. Savery/Stutes/Mayberry and Martinez are all making around 500k also.

    Having Howard at 100% makes the lineup better with Pence/Howard at 3/4, but what are the moves to make this team better? Not much going on in FA, and nothing on the farm is gonna vastly improve the big club.

    After 2013, they lose 20 million from Utley and Kendrick and possible 20 mil for Halladay from his vesting interest/option because he doesn’t pitch enough innings. $74 mill in contracts at that point excluding Pence, Ruiz and the other arb eligible guys.

  • bugs, thus more reasons, to add to the long list of reasons, that over the past 3 years, Amaro needed to add & infuse good, younger players, not ancient, overpaid, win now, players, with zero future, or upside.

  • If Hamels goes, other FA SPs:
    Anibal Sanchez
    Shawn Marcum
    Zack Grienke

  • Ruiz is 33 Years Old and though he’s playing great ball, a younger Catcher needs to be developed and be ready by 2014..

    Who could the Phils get in Return if they were to package both Hamels/Victorino let’s say to an AL Contending playoff team
    (Detroit/Cleveland/White Sox/Red Sox/Orioles) … Maybe they could get 3 Top Prospects at Positions of Need plus some Bullpen arms and then attempt to re-sign Hamels once Free-Agency begins after the Season..
    I believe Hames does want to return and play home, out on the West Coast and really has little interest in returning in Philadelphia.. He has seen the good and the bad with the local media, fans, bloggers,etc,etc and I think he’s ready to move back home..

  • Catcher is definitely a need.

    I would have to look at those teams to put together some trade scenarios.
    If they are gonna let these guys walk, then they have to trade them. Can’t let them go for nothing.

    For Hamels, wouldn’t want to be paired with Kershaw? Not to mention Matt Kemp.

  • If Phils have come to the decision that they are not going to re-sign Hamels,
    does anyone agree that it would be best to trade him and get some talent in return instead of losing him to Free-Agency.. Plus he could be dealt to an American League Team as opposed to being scooped up by the Dodgers who would probably scoop him up in Free-Agency.. (which could still happen)
    Same with Victorino who will be looking at $10-$12 Million Deal ..

  • Greinke would get eaten alive by the Philly Media/Fans, he’s not mentally tough enough.. Marcum/Sanchez are not bad #3/#4 Pitchers..
    If Doc & Lee don’t return close to their usual Top Form, it will be very difficult to return to the Top of NL East Division anytime soon

  • Paul, bugs, we need a young Catcher, 3b, 2b, LF & RF. We have Galvis to replace the pop-up king, once he is healthy, Pence will fine, Howard is an albatross, that we are stuck with, & we have some promising arms, in Worley, May, Biddle, Pettibone, Diekman, DeFratus & Aumont. I suggest-
    1- Trade Victorino & Lee to Toronto, for C D’Arnauld, CF Rasmus, 3B/2B Lawrie, RP Carreno +
    2- Thome to AL team for prospect.
    3- Rollins, Blanton & Cash to Boston for Middlebrooks +
    4- Trade/release Qualls, Martinez, & the rest of the afterberth on the 40 man roster.
    Rebuilt with good young players.
    1B Howard- 2B Lawrie- SS Galvis- 3B Middlebrooks- C Chooch- LF Mayberry/ Brown?- CF Rasmus- RF Pence.
    C D’Arnauld- IF Wiggington- OF Nix- OF Piere- IF Fontenot- ?
    Halladay- Hamels- Worley- May- Kendrick
    Papelbon, Aumont, DeFratus, Carreno, Diekman, Bastardo, & longman.
    Next year, re-sign Hamels & Pence, & give legit shots to Biddle & Pettibone. Then we still have $$$ to add an LF, if Brown/Mayberry still suck.

  • DCAR- I like how you are thinking except that May and Aumont are exactly lighting it up this year on the farm. I am all for bringing them up to see what they have, but they will need more pitching.

    If they can get that trade from Toronto, you would have to do it.

    No way Boston trades Middlebrooks especially for that slop. He is their 3B of the future.

  • bugsy, I hear ya, but sometimes minor leaguers hit a wall. Anyway, Aumont is just getting his arm back, after being hurt, the beginning of the year. May started off great, but his last 3 or so games where iffy. Both are future studs in waiting. IMHO, so is Biddle, DeFratus & Diekman. Can’t be no worse than Blanton, Kendrick, Qualls, Schwimmer, & the rest of the beer leaguers, we have. Middlebrooks might be a possibility if we send cash in return, because they can’t trade Youkalas. Amaro is an inept moron, so none of that will happen anyways. PIE IN THE SKY, MY BROTHER! LET’S HOPE. BTW, I read that Toronto rumor somewhere. Can’t remember if it was bleacher report, or somewhere else.

  • Dude, I am 100% behind bringing up all the kids. You may have a unique opportunity to see what you have. Bring Brown up too.

    I remember that Toronto rumor. For them, I think it will come down to if they think they have a legit shot to get in this year or if they think that they can re-sign either Hamels or Victorino which I don’t think that they do.

  • no way, no how the phillies let Hamels walk, this is there best and only home grown pitching talent since I can’t remember, maybe Rick Wise for you old timers out there, if the phils ownership believes they are an elite franchise like the red sox, yanks, dodgers, then they must put uot, and they will, to prove it by signing their own stud pitcher, as I said before, this is not your father’s phillies, they have spent a lot of money, some of it foolishly by Amaro, but they are players

  • RE : 2013
    I think it’s fair to say Phils are stuck with SS Rollins, now one is going to pick his Deal up at his age and productions levels which now means you play Galvis at 2B until ROllins Retires after 2014
    This means you need some Power #’s at 1B,3B and Outfield Corners..
    Phils have Howard and Pence for 2013 but need to fill 3B and LF

    Blue Jays lost 2 PItchers in B Morrow (their best Pitcher) and Drabeck to injury, they have not played very good ball the last couple of weeks as they are sliding down and out of the running in the AL east so they may not end up as Buyers come Trade Time..

  • Jake, do you think the Phils would decide with having Doc,Lee and Hamels all in the Rotation and with all 3 making $20 Million + a Season for 2013 ???
    I just don’t see them doing this.. I hope I am wronfg, $65 Million for 3 Pitchers… Yikes..

  • I see them trading Lee, an overrated pitcher, came up small agains the cardinals, inconsistent this year, not an ace, not worth the money

  • Not worth the money, then how are they going to trade him?

  • I could see Lee going back to Cleveland or to Detroit (of course he would have to waive his No-Trade Clause.. but why would anyone want to stay with a Team if you feel they don’t want you nay longer so I think he would waive the No-Trade Clause deal just to get out of town..

  • I am in favor of trading him to keep Hamels, but that is a tough contract to move.

  • I don’t think so bugsy, the yanks still covet him and he is still viewed as one of the top lefites in the game

  • Unfortunately scar you confuse facts with your OPINION

  • Jake, which is it? Is he overrated and not worth the money or is he viewed as one of the top lefties in the game by everyone but us and the Phils.

  • Busy don’t get pulled in the three of them make crap up, one minute a player is good the next they are overpaid… Jake actually said ‘the Phil’s have too much pitching’ dcat said 102 wins meant nothing… They GM without following rules they think top players will sign with them for 3 years

  • Neither Toronto or Boston would make those trades….no freaking way
    And Paul jones was in baltimores control he wasn’t free agent eligible and they weren’t going to trade him so what’s your point?

  • That’s it bugs, we know better

  • HAC, the only thing confused, is your imbecilic brain. I’ve stated all facts, truths, information, & things that have already commenced, not given opinions, you dope! Other than to say they won 102 games, what good was it, rock-head? WE LOST IN THE FIRST SERIES! Go away, you clueless idiot & let the logical, reasonable fans talk. You have ZERO credibility, being a step-ford, FO excuse making, pom-pom waving, zombie!

  • you aren’t a fan… you are an armchair QB and those like you give philly fans a bad name. you are a bandwagon jumper, negative– to the best of my knowledge no philly coach, gm or most of the time player is any good–
    i’m sure that when they were winning the 102 you were mr. philly fan– gave ruben NO credit for assembling that team. the minute they lose they are all bums. ridiculous– those things happen in sports and as a fan you roll with it, you get upset but you don’t look at all they’ve done and ignore it.

  • the Phillies are now 2-0 in my critical 23 game stretch ! here come the fightins

  • Ok Nev.We will be keeping count along with you..

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